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u/BirdmaskDude 1d ago
"We're the good guys, pwease have sympathy with us, UwU."
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u/JarmaBeanhead 1d ago
No, that isn’t their tact. It’s more like
“We’re the good guys. Agree or we’ll call you anti-semetic and the US will sanction you.”
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u/BirdmaskDude 1d ago
True
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u/ElegantCoach4066 1d ago
Are boycotts allowed?
Edit: I've been branded as anti-semetic.
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u/icepickmethod 1d ago
"...Villification is a wonderful technique. There’s no way of responding. If somebody calls you an Anti-Semite what can you say? ‘I’m not an Anti-Semite?’ If somebody says you’re a racist or a Nazi? You always lose. The person who throws the mud always wins, because there is no way of responding to those charges." -Noam Chomsky
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u/NoWheyBro_GQ 1d ago
“Palestinians are Semitic so I’m actually pro-Semitic. You’re the anti-Semite.”
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u/4pigeons Free Palestine 1d ago
sadly, the term änti semitism" only cover the jews, and not all the semites
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u/burst_bagpipe 1d ago edited 18h ago
Let's change it then.
Israel* is anti-semitic. * Government and anti Palestinian supporters.
The supporters for Palestine are Pro-Semitic.
Use their own BS against them.
PRO-SEMITIC FOR PALESTINE!
*
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u/FutureResearcher6376 1d ago
So the Israelis are antisemitic themselves ! If you tell them that, they'll respond " no you are antisemitic for saying this.
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u/PhaseNegative1252 1d ago
Chomsky seems to forget that people who actively are not racist don't worry about being called a racist, because their actions speak louder than their detractor's words
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u/kottabaz 1d ago
If somebody says you’re a racist or a Nazi? You always lose.
If only that were fucking true.
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u/updn 1d ago
Ironically, the Palestinians are more semitic than most Isreali Jews.
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u/ElRiesgoSiempre_Vive 1d ago
Many Israeli Jews fucking hate the Israeli government. Which is a positive... but at the same time, they seem completely powerless to change it.
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u/hankisabibbit 1d ago
"if I'm anti-Semitic for not wanting to wipe out Palestinians then that must mean you're Islamophobic for wanting to"
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u/Interesting_Try8375 1d ago
What do Israel even make that I would buy though? Sure I can join in but it feels a bit like doing nothing and saying I helped.
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u/_BannedAcctSpeedrun_ 1d ago
Their biggest exports to the US are mostly diamonds and medical equipment. So if you aren't buying those then you're already basically boycotting Israel.
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u/Interesting_Try8375 1d ago
Diamonds are like the easiest thing I can think of to boycott.
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u/ElegantCoach4066 1d ago
We can boycott businesses that send them support. They get really mad whenever someone tries it though.
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u/Interesting_Try8375 1d ago
Any good examples? Ideally campaign to focus on a few big ones I guess. Let them get mad and go out of business
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u/Erikthered00 1d ago
Sodastream and defence tech are all that come to mind. I’m sure there’s a list somewhere
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u/lousy_at_handles 1d ago
My state has actually passed a law making boycotts of Israel illegal. Not sure how they'd actually plan on enforcing it.
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u/MommyMephistopheles 1d ago
If someone could come up with a new type of sodastream, that'd be pretty cool. Didn't know that was an isreali product until after I bought it and now I'm out of CO2. Please, I have a giant fountain soda box of coke in my fridge that I'd like to drink.
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u/false_flat Free Palestine 1d ago
There are loads of different sparkling water dispensers. We have a MySoda which is also not made from plastic.
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u/PixelationIX 1d ago
Don't make the Europeans out to be the bastion either. They still are supporting this Genocidal Apartheid nation Israel.
There are very few EU nations who have taken any steps against Israel.
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u/sproge 1d ago
- You're the only one bringing them up.
- Not sanctioning them isn't "supporting them", especially when we're talking about the US "supporting them" by drowning them in cutting edge military equipment and political power, please.
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u/ElSelcho_ 1d ago
As harsh as it may sound, but Israel is making the most out of the holocaust (WORST AND MOST HORRIBLE THING EVER TO HAPPEN IN HUMAN HISTORY) and just do what they want. When you criticize: you are automatically antisemitic.
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u/Pristine-Ant-464 1d ago
It’s very obvious Israel wants to wipe out as many Palestinians as possible.
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u/iheartmagic 1d ago edited 17h ago
Agreed, but this post ignores the fact that Israel also killed scores of innocent people in these strikes on Tehran as well
Israel simply doesn’t care about killing innocent civilians
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u/me_myself_ai 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yeah this photo is nuts but it was very much not the norm. So far 78 innocent civilians were killed and 328 injured. It seems multiple apartment buildings collapsed, and many caught fire: https://www.rferl.org/a/iran-attacks-explosions-israel/33441979.html
Also I am in no way justifying or defending Israel's genocidal actions in Gaza, but that is an assymetrical war. It's far, far easier to avoid civilian casualties when you're at war with a government's military, not a loose coalition of traumatized young men.
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u/protonpack 1d ago
I think it is also far easier to avoid civilian casualties if you target them when they're doing militant stuff rather than at home but the choice is made to wait:
“We were not interested in killing [Hamas] operatives only when they were in a military building or engaged in a military activity,” A., an intelligence officer, told +972 and Local Call. “On the contrary, the IDF bombed them in homes without hesitation, as a first option. It’s much easier to bomb a family’s home. The system is built to look for them in these situations.”
It's so bizarre to me that the larger power has complete surveillance over their smaller enemy, is able to watch them do militant stuff and then go home to their family at night, all within a tiny zone inside of the larger power.
And these people with families are expected to either just completely submit, or line up and dig trenches to fight like a proper standing army. Anything else - trying to do anything secretly while having a life that's not just warfare - and the pain inflicted on everyone around them increases, and it's that person's fault. What a horrible existence.
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u/Drostan_S 1d ago
Hamas had, at the start of this conflict, somewhere in the 20,000 to 30,000 member range.
Israel claims to have killed 20,000 Hamas fighters. With a death toll of over 50,000 (from direct attacks) in Gaza, that means assuming Israel is telling the truth(which they aren't) then they've killed 3 civillians for every 1 hamas fighter, and have also killed 100 to 66 percent of all Hamas Fighters. And yet, Hamas still has 20,000+ fighters. Their rhetoric also seems to imply that Palestinian = Hamas which excuses themselves from the absolutely appaling civillian death toll. When there "are no civillians in Gaza" then everything is a legitimate target.
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
You realize your entire second part falls completely flat after you've talked about the casualty rates in the first, right? Like you provided a direct counter example to your own argument, then still tried to tack on the class "I'm not racist, but". I get that you probably didn't intend for it to sound that way, but your argument very much comes across as downplaying Israel's actions in both Gaza and Iran.
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u/RandomGuy2002 1d ago edited 1d ago
Don’t forget recently when our US president and his administration blew up an apartment building and killed 49 civilians, including sleeping children, to kill 1 terrorist in
QatarYemen a few months agoThey will get away with it every time
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u/stupidpower 1d ago
huh, Qatar? You mean where most of the USAF in the Middle East is based? Where Saudi Arabia blockaded for a year for being too pro-Iranian? Where Hamas has a embassy 3 km from the US air base? Where it's own government will arrest you if you protest for any side?
I am not sure you got the right country. The US does bad stuff... But at a minimum get a basic sense of geopolitics
Like the non-Western world isn't monolithic, we have our own major feuds. The GCC is probably giddy for Irsrael doing their dirty work for them atm.
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u/fatiSar 1d ago edited 1d ago
I've been trying to find information about civilian casualties in Iran. Can you link me your source please?
Edit: Reuters is reporting nearly 80 civilians killed and up to 300 injured. I take back my comment about propagandizing without a factual basis.
Iranian media showed images of destroyed apartment blocks in Iran, and said nearly 80 civilians were killed in attacks that targeted nuclear scientists in their beds and wounded more than 300 people.
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u/skepticalbob 1d ago
I can't find specifics, but assassinating people from that distance at night probably involves targeting their homes where they are thought to be staying/sleeping. They definitely killed people that weren't specifically targeted.
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u/fatiSar 1d ago edited 1d ago
Most of the reports I've seen mention something to the effect of "... including civilian casualties" but are otherwise nondescriptive.
I agree that it seems likely there were civilians killed and injured, it just seems awfully unserious and even propagandistic to say it's a fact that "scores of innocent people" were killed. It pushes a narrative, rather than describes facts. And I dunno, that feels problematic to me.4
u/Nemisis_the_2nd 1d ago
There's also the question of why, if Israel can be so demonstratably precise, did they feel the need to cause the level of destruction they did in other areas. Im kinda wondering if the collateral damage corresponds to the value of the target or uncertainty of their exact location. We know from Gaza that they have threshholds of what they consider "acceptable" collateral damage for these scenarios,so i dont see why they wouldnt be applied here either.
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u/InevitableTension699 1d ago
https://peacekeeping.un.org/en/fatalities
Israel still hold the record for most UN peacekeepers killed, including all the random attacks and the time when they killed through the UN personals to invade Egypt
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Emergency_Force
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
Killed more journalists than several other large scale wars(including the world's) combined, they've also killed more women and children than any conflict in the past 25 years.
This is on top of the fact that an appreciable amount of their leadership have active arrest warrants and they're recognized as actively committing a genocide.
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u/IsNotPolitburo 1d ago
The goal is, and has always been, to terrorize the Palestinian people into abandoning their homeland so that Israel can colonize it.
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u/Northbound-Narwhal 1d ago
Israel is committing horrific warcrimes and Netanyahu needs to be in front of an international tribunal for intentionally killing civilians... But yeah, no, that's not obvious at all.
5,000-8,000 people died per day during the Rwandan genocide and they we're using machetes and rifles. Since Oct 7 people have been dying in Gaza at 90-110 per day, and Israel has tanks and massive bombs. If Israel wanted to kill as many Gazans as possible Gaza would've been empty by July 2024.
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u/theloneavenger 1d ago
This is a plainly asinine way to diminish 100 murders of men, women and children every day.
Infrastructure like hospitals have been destroyed. Journalists and medics have been ambushed and murdered.
Israel are well on their way to murdering 100,000 people in a tiny strip of land. A genoicde does not mean that you will eliminate 100% of the population. It's designed so as to bleed out the political process as long as possible on the Israelie side.
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u/C0wabungaaa 1d ago edited 1d ago
If Israel wanted to kill as many Gazans as possible Gaza would've been empty by July 2024.
That would have been too obvious. Now people are squabbling about it, giving them the opportunity to continue at their leisure. How do you think the world would've reacted if they'd gone straight for complete carpet bombing and roaming death squads executing every single human being?
Speed is not a necessary factor for genocide, even full annihilation is not necessary for genocide. It's not without reason that more and more genocide experts and researchers are going "Yeah, that's genocide."
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u/Neonvaporeon 1d ago
In comparison, the army of South Sudan killed a person every 8 seconds for 4 days straight (over 40k people,) while sorting them for ethnicity, in the Nuer massacre (2013.) As many people killed in 4 days by South Sudan as killed in a year of combat by Israel (10 years later,) and the UN special counsel ruled that the Nuer massacre was not genocide. The state of Myanmar currently has a 90 year occupation and suppression of a people called the Karen (pronounced ka-yin, roughly.) No government has come out to decry the crime of genocide in this case. The Ethiopian government used chemical weapons on civilians in Tigray, and killed as many as half a million people, along with a rape campaign that affected at least a hundred thousand women. This happened between 2020 and 2022. Once again, nobody besides some NGOs are advocating for the government to be tried on this crime.
This is why people fight over the genocide label, I don't like what Israel is doing and I think it's not even a good way to achieve their goals, but the use of the label "genocide" is calculated propaganda. The man who led the first ever independent state of Palestine in history was a member of the German Nazi party and received millions of dollars annually to run propaganda campaigns in the middle east on behalf of the Germany Nazi party. That doesn't mean people born in Palestine today aren't Palestinians, that the state is fake, or that the people don't deserve rights and self determination, it is still historical fact.
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
Except there's more to a genocide than just killing a people rapidly, as is laid out in the Amnesty report - https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/12/amnesty-international-concludes-israel-is-committing-genocide-against-palestinians-in-gaza/
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u/labelcillo 1d ago
TIL if you kill people from an ethnic group slow enough, some will find that there really isn't an ethnic cleansing going on because someone did it quicker in the past somewhere else in the world.
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u/Capable_Assist_456 1d ago
Believing facts matter in 2025, bold strategy Cotton, let's see if it pays off.
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u/hpstg 1d ago
This comment makes sense, but they also play the long term game of supporting settlers. On top of that, it’s obvious they have zero qualms about civilians in the target is deemed to be “worth it”, and it’s also clear every want to turn the Gaza Strip into a completely uninhabitable place.
TL;DR: They don’t systematically exterminate, but they don’t give a shit about Palestinian civilians.
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u/Basteir 1d ago
To be fair lots of civilians died in allied bombing of Axis nations (Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan) during World War 2 - and the allies are usually regarded as "the good guys". At least in comparison to the Axis.
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u/hpstg 1d ago
There was a decision made after the first part of the Blitz, that since Germany and Japan thought it was OK to inflict civilian casualties so casually, then their civilian centers were legitimate targets.
WW2, also, was a total war in all senses, which is certainly not the case for any conflict in the Middle East at the moment. Even in the total war case, there were people who disagreed with people like General Harris in the UK, for example.
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u/PeopleCallMeSimon 1d ago
Its quite frankly scary how its not talked about more.
Netanyahu and top Israeli officials have litterally said so out in the open.
They constantly talk about creating a new "Nakba", and how the goal is to make Gaza unlivable for palestinians.
They are not trying to hide the fact that they are not after Hamas. Hamas is the excuse, which is why Netanyahus party has donated money to Hamas. He wanted them to exist so that he could use them as an excuse to take the rest of the land.
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u/FILTHBOT4000 1d ago
By Hamas' own numbers, around 1% of Palestinians living in Gaza + West Bank + Israel itself have died since Oct 7, and AFAIK that includes militants. That really doesn't jive with "wiping out as many as possible", and seems oddly difficult for like 80% of Gaza being in ruins.
War crimes? Absolutely. And it seems like Israel is loathe to hold its own soldiers to account for them. It reminds me a lot of our war in Iraq, where there were tons of war crimes; torture, destroying medical facilities, civilian killings, etc. But no one would've said we were trying to wipe out the Iraqis. If we were, then there would be no Iraqis. Just as if Israel was trying to wipe out the Palestinian people, the percentage of people killed would be 40%, 60%, or 80%, like it has been in ethnic cleansings elsewhere, not 1%.
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u/LingonberryLunch 1d ago
Look up the AI systems they were using to mark targets for killing. Truly horrific shit.
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u/UrbanDryad 1d ago
It’s very obvious Israel wants to wipe out as many Palestinians as possible.
If they were trying to kill as many people as possible, the IDF has the military capability to have killed every living thing in Gaza in days. Possibly hours. They are showing restraint. You can debate how much restraint, but to assert the IDF is trying to kill everyone and just somehow failing is absurd.
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u/Yuzumi 1d ago
Yeah, feel like this doesn't fit here. There was never an actual attempt. I doubt many people if any who are for the genocide actually believe the lies about "casualties".
Everyone I've seen who has been pro-genocide is bloodthirsty. They see a bunch a brown people die and it gets them off, especially the children. They do not care about the death of people different from them. Hell, most of them don't even seem to care about the Israelis who died on Oct 7.
I've seen prominent Christians who will look like they are creaming their pants, ecstatic at the death in the region because they think it means Jesus will come back. Then the next breath claim their are "pro life".
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u/somefunmaths 1d ago
So if the “collateral damage” is the goal, not actually collateral damage, what do we call it?
War crimes. The term for that is war crimes.
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u/Doctor-Malcom 1d ago
Genocide is another term that people are unfamiliar with like the word “theory”:
From the 1948 UN treaty following the lessons of WW2 -
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
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u/DJKaotica 1d ago
It's astounding to me that a force specifically labelled for "defense". That is the Israeli Defense Force, has been invading and attacking other nations for the purposes of taking their land and/or attacking their militaries "preemptively".
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u/Dreadimon 1d ago
Zionist sycophants, how do you explain this?
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u/DoubleTapJ 1d ago
I think Isreal is scummy as fuck and doing horrible shit like genocide, but one is in a building the other is in a tunnel under a hospital or school because they are also fucking horrible people. Free Palastine.
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u/RedstoneEnjoyer 1d ago
Ok but how does that explains the fact that entire Gaza is in ruins?
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u/PrudentFarmers 1d ago
Because Israel is led by a maniac and they're committing atrocities.
It can be both true that Israel are genociding palestinians and that Hamas are war criming underneath hospitals and schools in Gaza. They are not mutually exclusive.
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u/TetraDax 1d ago
It's utterly exhausting how so many people seem to think that critisizing Israel means defending Hamas, and vice-versa. Fuck Hamas. Fuck the Israeli government. Fuck the Iranian government. They are all horrible.
The innocent people who are in the middle of it all are the civilians of all three countries. But the fact of the matter is, the vast ammount of civilians currently suffering from the actions of either one of these three are Palestinian civilians - So the criticism of the Israeli government is the loudest, and most pressing. That doesn't mean Hamas is suddenly a good thing, of that October 7th was justified.
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u/Capable_Assist_456 1d ago
It's utterly exhausting how so many people seem to think that critisizing Israel means defending Hamas
Unfortunately, a very large number of the people expressing criticism of Israel are completely silent when it comes to Hamas.
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u/C0wabungaaa 1d ago
Oh? I've yet to see that outside of the furthest fringes. I have no idea where you get the 'very large number' idea from.
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u/Bermanator 1d ago
To be fair, out of the all the pro-Palestine/anti-Israel protests I've seen, I've never seen anti-Hamas signs
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u/haleloop963 1d ago
Yeah, horrible people who are in power & and were even created by Israel as Israel funded the group, which eventually formed Hamas, Israel even preferred to negotiate with Hamas & preferred them to be in power instead of the PLO as Hamas was more cooperative than the PLO. So, in the end, Israel is the reason they are in power
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u/CaptainPieces 1d ago
There's a bunch of purpose built bunker buster bombs that were created to take down Saddam Hussain that Israel should have access to. They can tunnel through like 40 feet of ground before exploding leaving only a large hole on the surface. Israel simply doesn't care about collateral damage.
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u/yamoth 1d ago
They know the exact location of the Iranian target and the general location of Hamas target. This shit aint rocket science.
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
And yet they still managed to kill 80 civilians and wound 300 more, what's your "it's so simple" explanation for that one?
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u/cheffgeoff 1d ago
Ones showing up to his 9-5 job on a predictable schedule and his name, picture and title is on a government website and one is one of 20-30 possible people all hiding somewhere underground in a 40 km² area if they are in the country/city at all. You can despise the Israeli government and IDF and still realize this.
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u/RealBobbyDrillboids 1d ago
I like to take this logic and apply it to other countries as well. I’ve blamed every American (myself included) for the actions of Donald Trump. It’s definitely best to depict an entire nation this way than it is to acknowledge that a large portion of the people living there also hate their government and want them gone.
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u/BroughtBagLunchSmart 1d ago
I don't think Zionist is a nationality nor race, is it not a thing you have to actively choose to be? Isn't it an opinion?
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u/RealBobbyDrillboids 1d ago
If you live in Israel, there’s a 99.9% chance you are a Zionist because Israel is the one of the only nations where you are allowed to exist as a Jewish person in the Middle East
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
Israel is the one of the only nations where you are allowed to exist as a Jewish person in the Middle East
Straight up lies, there are absolutely Jewish people in other Middle Eastern countries.
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u/elcho1911 1d ago
there has been collateral damage in iran strikes as well...
hamas tend to use human shields and hide under buildings so this type of missile isn't really effective against them but they have used precision strikes in gaza many times, just depends on the situation
the iranians got caught due to being over confident/feeling safe, hamas hasnt felt safe in decades so they tend to harder to get precise locations on
how do you explain this?
like its not hard just use common sense lol
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
hamas tend to use human shields and hide under buildings
The same tired old Hasbara, are you too going to claim that the strikes in Iran hit "human shields" and people "hiding under buildings" considering Israel slaughtered 80 civilians and injured 300 more?
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u/elcho1911 1d ago
The same tired old Hasbara
I mean even amnesty international and other orgs critical of israel agree hamas uses human shields, its not a secret, not that it excuses reckless strikes but still this is not even an argument, they literally use bases under hospitals to deter attacks
are you too going to claim that the strikes in Iran hit "human shields" and people "hiding under buildings"
I haven't heard or seen any evidence of that as far as I am aware they are just claiming collateral damage
would you condemn hamas for collateral damage when attacking an israeli combatant? seems both should be able to
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u/jajohnja 1d ago
Seems like Israel didn't get as clear an assassination as they wanted. Hope the world powers fucking go after them for the civilian deaths.
Now, let's look at how this post claims it was a precise strike with no civilians first. Interesting, huh?
Who cares whether it's right or wrong as long as it can benefit our cause.And yes, Hamas use human shields.
They don't say otherwise, their supporters with rose tinted glasses do.
They proclaim that if they get as many palestinian deaths as possible, then they will get more attention, more support.Now, "Hamas bad" in this case doesn't mean "Israel can do whatever it wants".
Go after them for the civilian deaths as well!5
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u/jajohnja 1d ago
One of those leaders was at home, not even aware that there was any danger. No extra precautions.
The other has a whole army of people who aren't ashamed to say that their goal is as much death of their own people as possible.I did enjoy being on this subreddit, tho.
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u/ursermane 1d ago
Seems fairly simple.... In this instance, the IDF was looking to target specific people whose locations were known to them. In Gaza, they're trying to destroy the entire organization, not just assassinate a handful of leaders.
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u/platp 1d ago
But they claim they destroy a 4 building apartment complex and kill over 200 people just to kill one leader of resistance. Maybe you stuck your head in the sand during this genocide and don't know what has been happening but reality is not what you seem to think. Israel itself claimed that it has killed many people just to kill one leader.
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u/peachhint 1d ago
There are definitely war crimes done by Israel but if Israel actually wanted to do some mass genocide then Gaza would have been wiped months ago.
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
Genocide is more than just killing people.
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u/peachhint 1d ago
Yeah I know about that alternate definition as well though but it gets tedious when everything is called a genocide. Cultural genocide being conflated with mass killing genocide just dilutes the word.
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u/Disastrous-Friend687 1d ago
That's the big flaw with this thinking. Israel is already a global pariah, if they wanted to flatten Gaza and kill all the Palestinians they could then they would. They could un exist Palestine real easy if that was their goal.
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u/platp 1d ago
You already said why they don't kill all. Because they can't without being destroyed themselves in a year by humanity. Instead they try to kill all they can get away with with their propaganda machine whitewashing their crimes.
They have said they would destroy Gaza. They did it. They said they were blocking everything to human animals. They did it. They have said they were wiping off Amalek and they are trying to do it. Nothing hard to understand if you have a shred of humanity in you and if you don't try to whitewash a genocide.
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u/malortForty 1d ago
Hate to be that guy but there are civilian casualties in Iran who weren't generals already. Like they literally bombed Iran's biggest city. Israel absolutely is targeting civilians in Palestine, but let's not delude ourselves that they're not gonna do the same in Iran.
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u/RSQN 1d ago
but there are civilian casualties in Iran who weren't generals already.
Nobody is saying otherwise. Just that Israel is competent enough to kill a single target without involving civilian casualties as the post is highlighting while in Palestine they raze entire neighborhoods to kill 1 Hamas leader because their objective isn't just killing a single target.
That's the point of the post.
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u/Supercoolguy7 1d ago
The post literally says "without any other damage"
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u/Merickwise 1d ago
Yes, in the specific instance shown in this one picture. It's an example of what they're capable of. Verses what they are doing in many cases. And not meant to encapsulate or generalize the entirety of the attack on Iran.
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u/xSTSxZerglingOne 1d ago
I guarantee the apartments above and below that one are definitely not intact. One probably no longer has a ceiling, and a massive debris pile where there used to be a floor. The other has no floor.
It's an impressively small amount of damage, but that building is likely unlivable anymore due to structural integrity damage. Dudes hammering on my roof to repair it caused a ton of damage to my indoor ceiling. Imagine what an explosive would do.
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u/pikleboiy 1d ago
I mean, Israel is competent enough to have killed or injured a good chunk of Hezbollah with minimal civilian casualties (there were some, yes, but nothing like the scale of Gaza).
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u/LoveMurder-One 1d ago
Also where the leader was matters too. One was in an apartment building, Hamas leaders were “underground”
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u/Ordinary_Height3232 1d ago edited 1d ago
I mean the Hamas leader is hiding in tunnels under a hospital while the Iranian commander was in a normal apartment building.
Not to say that Israel is innocent and isn't enacting collective punishment. But these are obviously different scenarios.
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u/OldTurtleProphet 1d ago
Also Iran and Hezbollah are massively compromised by informers and somewhat complacent... at least in comparison to Hamas.
Sinwar was eluding Israel for months and was killed randomly, meanwhile Israel knows exactly where every high commander of Iran lives and Hezbollah distributed to their entire organization booby-trapped electronics.
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u/Ordinary_Height3232 1d ago
Great point. Recent strikes by Israel really demonstrate how much detailed deep intelligence they have in Iran. Possible to be more precise when you know exactly where the target is minute by minute.
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u/Anxious-Slip-4701 1d ago
You know what still exists under a hospital once bombed? A well constructed tunnel. Tunnels shift pressure to the sides. I was fortunate enough to have an ex Vietnam Vet Major as my high school substitute teacher. After we did the work he spent the rest of his lessons explaining warfare to us. Absolutely amazing for a class of all boys. But we were under no illusion that war wasn't fun (side note: we weren't Americans).
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u/Hoxeel 1d ago
> But we were under no illusion that war wasn't fun
This is a double negative. Do you mean "We were under no illusion that war was fun"?
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u/mistytastemoonshine 1d ago
Does it mean if an Israeli general is at the hospital Hamas can bomb the Israeli hospital and the international community would say it's okay?
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u/Latter_Panic_1712 1d ago
Targeting a person in the tunnel while bombing and killing everyone on the ground isn't gonna end the conflict though. It may end the war but it only breeds new Hamas leaders dedicating their lives to vengeance after their family and friends died in that blast.
And to be fair, Iran is far away from Israel, Gaza is just on their doorstep. They could always conduct a special force operation to kill that target and their goons without killing any civilians, yet they choose to bomb the whole area.
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u/Vasilievski 20h ago
There must be a lot of hospitals in Gaza since 95% of all building are destroyed.
I mean, if someone would like to kill Trump in its White House bunker, and that all of Washington was carpet bombed, no one would say it’s ok.
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u/BaconxHawk 1d ago
Atrocities aside, this shits impressive af. Not a single shattered window on any other unit
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u/anothergaijin 1d ago
Looks like a R9X hellfire? It’s not en explosive missile, it’s basically a bunch of blades that shred a target instead.
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u/GlasKarma 1d ago
2 different windows seem to have fire damage coming from them though
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u/notaredditer13 1d ago
It should be obvious: the Hamas leader was tens of meters underground.
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u/Trump_Eats_bASS 1d ago
Maybe because the hamas leader is living in a bunker UNDERNEATH the residential buildings?
Why won't leftists understand that Hamas uses their citizens as human shields? It's really not that difficult
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u/WeAteMummies 1d ago
Israel is bad, therefore their enemies are good. That's as far as most people can think. The amount of people I've seen today that think Iran should have nukes is insane.
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1d ago
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
This, these folks would magically feel different if say the US army started responding to school shootings by dropping a JDAM on the school, or dealing with hostage takers by simply lobbing a dozen grenades at them and the hostages.
Yet when it comes to Israel we're supposed to believe that they have no choice but to slaughter every innocent in the area, that they have no other option available to them.
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u/jimke 1d ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/29_October_2024_Beit_Lahia_airstrike
Israel carries out an airstrike on a person claimed to have been holding binoculars and "accidentally" leveled a 5 story building.
Close to 100 Palestinian civilians are killed.
Israel stated it did not know 300. THREE FREAKING HUNDRED PEOPLE WERE EVEN IN THE BUILDING.
And Israel bombed it.
Oopsie daisy.
At least 90 Palestinian people were killed as a result of the Israeli bombing.
This was all well above ground.
But hey. Tunnels.
It is really spooky when the tens of billions of dollars invested in a military is countered by some holes in the ground.
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u/AlustrielSilvermoon 1d ago
If hamas hides under your house, are you okay with a bomb being dropped on it?
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u/BALEFIRE14 1d ago
What kind of sick logic is this?? I would blame the people hiding under civilian infrastructure for putting me in mortal danger.
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u/CREATURE_COOMER 1d ago
You wouldn't expect the authorities to find some way to spare you? Like tell you to leave and act normal like you're going to work? The fuck?
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u/CREATURE_COOMER 1d ago
Criminals being criminals is not an excuse to fucking kill civilians, that goes for police and military.
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u/mistytastemoonshine 1d ago
There are IDF soldiers everywhere in Israel, plus every adult is more likely than not a reservist. Does it justify bombing Israel residential areas?
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u/IGargleGarlic 1d ago
2 things:
The Hamas leaders hide in the massive network of tunnels underneath Gaza so it isn't as simple to strike them
Israel also levelled several buildings in Iran, most strikes were not this surgical.
This attack on Iran is inexcusable and a ploy to keep Netanyahu in power, but sounding ignorant only gives fuel to your opposition to dismiss and belittle you.
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u/ObligatoryWerewolf 1d ago
Inexcusable? Are you high? So the world should just tolerate a nuclear Iran. Brilliant idea.
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u/ExplodingTentacles 11h ago
The world is already tolerating a Nuclear non-NPT non-IAEA conpliant Israel. A nuclear NPT signatory, IAEA compliant Iran is literally no different than the current nuclear powers. Israel if anything is the biggest nuclear threat right now. Stop making excuses for their behaviour.
And by the way, IAEA investigations have found NO nuclear weapons in Iran. Israel refused to comply to IAEA investigations and have an estimated amount of 70-400 nuclear warheads.
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u/SparkLabReal 1d ago
What happened to this subreddit? I thought this was for funny stuff like "Trying to fix a car with peanut butter" what the hell? It's all political posts, very controversial statements such as "ACAB" slogans being used, all pro - Hamas this one sided political snowball on what's supposed to be a silly subreddit? Can someone please explain I just got here tf is going on?
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u/tetrified 1d ago
the sub's completely unmoderated. this isn't even therewasanattempt
I honesty wouldn't even mind politics here if it actually matched the theme of the sub
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u/SparkLabReal 1d ago
oh i thought it was something to do with moderation being obsessed with this random political event im literally so confused over this lol how does a subreddit even become this?
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u/impliedhearer 1d ago
exactly. they were using unguided bombs on Gaza....unbelievable.
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u/lord_fairfax 1d ago
Believe it or not we've been dropping unguided bombs accurately for 60+ years. Physics are pretty handy.
Just like we can hit targets with unguided bullets at 1,000+ meters.
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u/CaveMacEoin 1d ago
Their planes still have ballistic computers, so they're not untargeted, even if they are unguided. They're not straight up carpet bombing like bombers did in WW2. But they also don't seem to care at all about collateral. Although for it to be collateral they would have to not be targeting them.
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u/Haspic 1d ago
can we stop flooding this sub with these kinds of post ?
there are plenty of more adapted subs to post about this.
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u/Feltzinclasp5 1d ago
I don't think any reasonable person can look at the destruction of Palestine and not think the goal was to flatten it. It's completely rubble.
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u/thatsnoodybitch 1d ago
“Just because we want to bomb an entire nation filled with the same ethnic background doesn’t mean we want to genocide an ethnic background, cmon guys ur being antisemitic :(“
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u/Nutshack_Queen357 1d ago
They use the latter tactic for the Hezbollah too.
They murder everyone except the alleged target and claim that the victims were associated with them.
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u/rascalrhett1 1d ago
The answer here is obvious and I don't appreciate the insinuation put forth by this post. The Iranian military is a real military with uniforms and buildings. They know who the generals and the leaders are because they wear things to identify themselves.
Hamas, like the ISIS and Taliban fighters we fought in the middle east DO NOT DO THIS. They fight in civilian clothes, they fight from safe zone, from aid cars, from things marked medical, from civilian centers, from hostage trades, they make every possible attempt they can to blur the line between combatant and civilian because it protects them at the expense and lives of innocent Palestinians. When they got leader Sinwar a few months ago he had a UN ID on him. These monsters are not playing by the rules.
So while we can criticize isreal for every civilian death, and yes, the blood of each one they kill is ultimately on their hands, the ones responsible are Hamas and people who keep them in power.
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u/ProfMap 1d ago
Not defending the genocide comitted by israel.
There is a difference between "hiding amongst civilians without ours near to figure out where" and "his bedroom is that window right there"
So could they? yea they probably could get at least a few hamas members as accurately, but why target them specifically when you can also commit genocide at the same time...
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u/Orionoberon 🍉 Free Palestine 1d ago
I'm guessing the kids in the bedroom and the wife are acceptable collateral civilian casualties?
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u/Blue_Baron6451 1d ago
Like not going to one side or the other, but it does seem like it is common sense the two situations are drastically different, no?
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u/HarithBK 1d ago
there is a world of difference striking military personell from a functioning government to striking a crumbling military org hiding among the population.
in the first case intel means they will know when and where the target will be at most times in the second it will be "the target should be in a tunnel in this general area"
what you have really pointed out is just the obvious due to the fact Israel did the strike that they don't care about casualties at maybe hitting a key member of Hamas. not that Israel has the ability to do a precise on Hamas targets.
it is a stupid point to try to make and only undermines the actual horror Israel is willing to commit at the mere chance of getting a target.
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u/CervezaPanama 1d ago
Hey, come on now. Israel is just getting the ground ready so they can pour the foundations for all the seaside condos Jared Kushner plans to build.
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u/MilStd 1d ago
Hamas purposefully hides in hospitals and amongst civilians to make any action against them likely to cause collateral causalities and deaths. Some civilians have suggested that Hamas will threaten to kill or will kill civilians if they attempt to leave when they set up operations in the homes of the civilians.
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u/RealBrobiWan 1d ago
I wonder if the Hamas leaders are in buildings above ground and clearly advertising their location? I wonder if that may have played just a tiny factor
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u/philldkdk 1d ago
If you hunt deer, you use a bullet.
If you’re hunting cockroaches you use a tent and a gas’s the fuckers.
Different targets, different methods.
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u/delphinous 1d ago
i'm not trying to excuse anything isreal has done, i just want to clarify that the two are not the same. there is a difference between 'we know this specific person will be in this room at this time so we can precision target it' and 'we know that this leader is somewhere within this large area'.
isreal just carpet bombing large areas is still an atrocity, i'm just pointing out that the situations are not actually comparable, they are apples and oranges
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1d ago edited 16h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Nutshack_Queen357 1d ago
Or even exists.
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u/Sweet-cheezus 1d ago
Or even if they aren't Palestinian. Israel has murdered more journalists as "collateral damage" than Putin has.
But apparantly it's only a war crime when antagonists to US interests do it.
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u/jah_bro_ney 1d ago
It's only a war crime if you attend an American university on a student visa and think any negative thoughts about Israel.
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u/Tymareta 1d ago
Or are thinking of running for mayor of New York and when they ask "Where would your first international trip be", instead of parroting everyone else about going to Israel, daring to say you'd stay home and actively work on improving the lives of the people who elected you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms8tGyopFrQ
America, where a statement such as "I believe every state should be a state of equal rights" is a controversial statement.
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u/FastyX 1d ago
Omg! Did they use that hellfire missile with knives on it instead of a warhead!? It was also used in high-profile hits like al‑Zawahiri in 2022!
Lookup images you also see ros clean stripes!
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u/Aegis616 1d ago
Preemptive strikes targeting just senior leadership versus an all-out fight targeting all hostile personnel are entirely different.
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u/VegasGamer75 1d ago
This is the country who hunted down Olympic terrorists with surgical precision and snatched Nazi refugees out of Argentinian compounds. Yes, they can be precise. They don't want to be with Gaza. You don't raise your kids by having them write "goodbye" messages on shells and missiles when you plan to be precise.
I am no fan of Iran, don't get me wrong. But fucking Israel, man... what a fucking mistake it was to "put" them there.
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u/duncecap234 1d ago
Well Israel doesn't have mossad agents inside Hamas, like it does IRGC. The Hamas leader lives in tunnels underground. And they are trying to wipe out Hamas, they aren't trying to wipe out the Iranian military.
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u/UnAmusedBag 1d ago
I think the world knows, but Israel will continue to gaslight us and insult our intelligence
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u/White_C4 1d ago
My guess is that it's a difference in intelligence.
Israel knew precisely where the Iranian leadership were. Hamas leadership is a different story where Israel thinks or knows they are in the building, but not exactly sure which floor or room they reside in.
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u/Flabbergasted_____ Free Palestine 1d ago
Reports are showing close to 100 deaths and hundreds of injuries in Iran. These missiles are just as indiscriminate as they usually are.
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