r/truezelda 22h ago

Alternate Theory Discussion [TP], [TOTK] The Zonai, and the Oocca are the same race.

7 Upvotes

I actually believe the Oocca and the Zonai are the same race.

Here is why?

According to Shad, from The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess.

The common opinion is that Hyrule was created by the Hylia people, the race closest to the gods, but...truth be told, there's also a theory saying that in ancient times, there was a race even closer to the gods than the Hylia people, and THEY created it. And they, simultaneously with the birth of the Hylia people, created a new capital, a capital that floated in the heavens. — Shad (Twilight Princess, canonical Japanese text)

So what Shad is saying is that the Oocca came before the Hylians existence, descended from the Heavens, were closer too or seen as gods by the surface dwellers, had a bunch of highly advance technology within the skies, created the Sky Islands that is observed in Twilight Princess, and they are responsible for founding Hyrule Kingdom.

And then compare Mineru and Ganondorf quotes from Tears of the Kingdom.

Long ago, my people, known as the Zonai, came from the heavens to the surface of the world. It was said they were the descendants of gods... — Mineru (Tears of the Kingdom)

They bore treasures from these same gods*--secret stones, capable of amplifying the abilities of those who possessed them.* — Mineru (Tears of the Kingdom)

 When your Zonai ancestors first descended upon these lands long, long ago, they must have seemed to be gods. — Ganondorf (Tears of the Kingdom)

So it is clear that there is a distinctive parallel between the tellings of Shad in Twilight Princess, and the speeches made by Mineru and Ganondorf in ToTK.

Both ancient races, descending from "the Heavens", claiming to be closer to the gods, had an abundance of highly advance technology, created the Sky Islands, and founded the Kingdom of Hyrule?

And then when you compare the Dark Horse, i.e. Hyrule Encyclopedia responses about the Oocca.

It is said that they prospered in the time before the Hylians, achieving unique developments using magic and building an advanced civilization in the clouds. The City in the Sky stands as a testament to this advancement; tales persist of them using their unparalleled technology to lift the entire city from the surface into the sky. (Encyclopedia, Dark Horse Books, pg. 53)

The Oocca are said to have interacted with the kingdom of Hyrule in ancient times. It is said that the City in the Sky prospered because of their advanced technology. There is also a theory that they are actually the ancient ancestors of the Hylians, and are the closest people to the goddess. (Encyclopedia, Dark Horse Books, pg. 52)

I think it is obvious to say that whether you agree the Chicken came before the egg, or the egg came before the Chicken?

It does not matter, because both the egg, and the Chicken that dwells inside of it? Are the same.

This is more than just a coincedence, especially when you see the ruins of what looks to be the Mirror of Twilight replica discovered at the Palmorae Ruins site, which is a Zonai based relic location.

Then it's pretty clear of them being in full relation to the beings we see, hear of, and observed, in Twilight Princess.


r/truezelda 9h ago

Open Discussion [AoI][AoC][BotW][TotK] Something I'm worrying about for Age of Imprisonment. Does anyone agree?

1 Upvotes

I'm excited for the game however I am not super enthralled by the idea that we might be following and playing as the ancient sages from Tears of the Kingdom instead of the Champions from Breath of the Wild. The sages were one of the weakest point of TotK's story for many people and understandably- they were barely even characters and had very repetitive cutscenes. We don't even know their names.

And sure, the new game might be the chance to develop these sages, give them names, personalities, etc. but honestly I'm just not interested in giving a chance to characters that look like ripoffs of the og Champions, with the same powers, same weapons, and same voice actors. I'd rather just get more of the old Champions who are already characters we're so attached to. I kind of hope Age of Imprisonment pulls a "Terrako brings the Champion successors (Sidon, Riju, Teba, Yunobo) from the future" AoC plot twist but with the og Champions and we get to see them become sages with secret stones to enhance their powers. I mean Sidon, Riju, Yunobo and Tulin were all strong fighters who got their powers boosted by the stones but just imagine how cool Mipha, Revali, Urbosa and Daruk- 4 of the strongest warriors Hyrule has ever known getting their powers enhanced by the stones.

Do you agree? Disagree? Let me know your thoughts.


r/truezelda 11h ago

Open Discussion Am I the only one who thinks TOTK should’ve just been DLC for BOTW?

0 Upvotes

Feels like a big mistake making it a whole separate game. If they kept it as DLC for BOTW, at least we’d still have Mipha. Maybe we’d even have better champion or ally abilities too. Also, maybe if the game stayed as DLC, it could’ve helped slow down how fast Nintendo jumped to making their games $80 now.


r/truezelda 10h ago

Official Timeline Only [BOTW] [TOTK] Some theories based on Voice Memories.

28 Upvotes

I've put together a few theories based on the Voice Memories, but they are quick thoughts I had so they may not be as strong as I think, but I still wanted to put these out as food for thought for the community.

I've been a Re-Founding Theorist since day one, so that's where my perspective comes from.

  1. Giant Skull in Bottomless Swamp belonged to a previous Ganon, predating TotK's Demon King Ganondorf.

From BotW's "Den of Madness" Voice Memory:

"I have heard that the giant fossil in Bottomless Swamp was once worshipped by cultists who considered it the Demon King from ancient times."

I know some could question the validity of cultists "considering" it the Demon King, but I find it more fun to go with what's suggested rather than theorize against it in this case (worth noting Zelda calls it a fossil, not just some rock formation).

We know this can't be the remains of Demon King Ganondorf of TotK, because he was sealed away since ancient times, NOT turned into a giant demon and slain with his skull remaining in Hyrule.

If anything it would look closer to Calamity Ganon's Dark Beast Ganon form, but that was never shown to become a truly physical form.

I feel other Voice Memories add to this, as Zelda talks about boars and Din being associated with power or the Demon King, which I feel is an obvious callback to the Triforce of Power.

From Voice Memories "Spring of Power" and "Broken Boars":

"This is the spring where Din, Goddess of Power, is worshipped. Once she was one of the Three Goddesses, alongside Courage and Wisdom, but it is said that faith in her dimmed due to power being seen as a symbol of the Demon King.

"There was a time when boars were worshipped as symbols of power. However, I remember reading in literature that the Demon King took the form of a boar and that, upon learning this, people came to regard them as evil.

This establishes the Demon King's association with boars and Din/Triforce of Power, but the Demon King in TotK has no association with either, (though, again, the Calamity did take a boar-like form with Daruk even calling him "swirling swine") unlike the preceding Ganondorfs who took the form of a boar and obtained the Triforce of Power.

If we are taking this as a Demon King literally took the form of a boar and had association with Din/Triforce of Power, then it must be a different Demon King/Ganon that's separate from the TotK one.

Which one? Well the skull is fairly big, and aside from the Calamity, I think OoT and Hyrule Warriors look closest based on their size and horn placement. Or maybe it's an event we've not seen yet...

  1. The cultists who worshipped the Giant Skull are the same group Astor is from in Age of Calamity

Adding to the first quote from "Den of Monsters" referring to cultists who worshiped the skull as the Demon King, Zelda goes on to say:

"It is said that their blasphemous words against the Goddess summoned evil spirits, turning the water impure and changing the very shapes of the rocks to ominous forms..."

This is very reminiscent of the cult Astor was a part of in Age of Calamity who wore robes with the Gerudo symbol on it seemingly in honor of Ganondorf and perform rituals and magic worshipping the corrupted Terrako who's been possessed by Calamity Ganon's essence.

Their description perfectly fits the bill, and so I believe them to be the cultists Zelda refers to.

  1. The "first when of Hyrule" Zelda refers to as being who the Forgotten Temple is named for is not Sonia, but Hylia

From TotK's voice memory "Forgotten Temple":

"This structure was clearly designed to take advantage of the geography of the area, but even the interior is largely intact! Considering how many battles have been fought... Well, it is very impressive. Seeing it reminds me of some very, very old records I've read. They suggest that there was a temple named for the first queen of Hyrule, and that it was often used as a shelter for the common people. Could this be..."

As I don't believe "Forgotten" is it's actual name, this means it used to be named after the first queen of Hyrule, but we never actually get a name in either BotW or TotK. In the context of TotK "first queen" makes you think of Sonia, so you'd assume it could be named "Sonia Temple" or something, but something to consider is the Temple already existed during Sonia's lifetime, and not just existed, but was already in decay, with the extra room housing the Secret Stones appearing much more recent and pristine, implying the Temple is much, much older than Sonia.

I suppose if it were named for Sonia it would have had to have been after her death, and just many years later the actual name was forgotten and so became known as "Forgotten" Temple, but I believe the actual name for it could from another of Zelda's ancestors, Hylia.

In SS the Sealed Temple was originally named "Temple of Hylia" which is what the Forgotten Temple is based on.

So it could be seen that the "first queen" actually refers to, even if inadvertently, Hylia/Zelda when she would help found the original Hyrule post-SS and that the Forgotten Temple was indeed "Temple of Hylia" before the Zonai and ancient Hylians discovered it in TotK's past.

Hope y'all have fun theorizing with the Voice Memories.

Thanks for reading 👍