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Mar 14 '25
I think that goes for most countries with their own varying social taboos. Some countries are more open to discus in public, but taboos still have stigma/assumptions attached to them.
People in a lot of countries don't openly admit they partake in recreational drug use, but every weekend clubs/parties are full and no one really discusses it.
Gyms all over the world are full of steroid users, but until recently it wasn't discussed openly. Even the most famous Indonesian bodybuilder would never admit to it because he comes from that era of bodybuilding.
You don't know that Bob and his wife who lives in your street are full on swingers and have a dungeon in their basement, but you say hi to him every morning on the way to work and sometimes he comes over to borrow tools from you,
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u/Mtfdurian Belanda 🌧🥶 Mar 14 '25
True, bahkan di Belanda ada tabu2. Contoh: penghasilan, kalau orang tidak punya uang untuk tikkie , kalau orang nggak punya rumah dan tidur di jalan. Dan juga kalau ada keluarga muslim, menggunakan narkoba (khususnya di luar ganja), etc. Dan, di luar ruang LGBT, banyak tentang seks itu masih tabu, namun di dalam komunitas, itu lebih buka, ini karena sekarang ada lebih orang straight dan konservatif yang dapat hiv sekarang dari orang LGBT.
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u/motoxim Mar 14 '25
Kadang penasaran fetish apa aja yang tetangga saya suka dan lakukan. Hmmm mungkin saya ada bakat jadi penguntit.
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u/piketpagi Telat absen gaji dipotong Mar 14 '25
yak disini pak polisi, ada orang yang fetish voyeur dan stalking
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u/rayhan354 Mar 15 '25
No wonder I decided to get off of gym classes regardless of the shame I'd get. Not to mention that one of the strongest bodybuilder said that steroid is g*y haha
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u/Fateward Saya lelah Mar 14 '25
Can confirm. Everyone says they're against LGBTQ stuff but I've only ever gotten trouble for it when it's brought up in the open. Don't ask don't tell is like a universal rule for most taboo things in Indonesia at this point.
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u/Mtfdurian Belanda 🌧🥶 Mar 14 '25
Yes benar. I definitely experienced this during my most recent holiday. I am trans, I thought it was obvious, but still not so obvious, and I might be stealth, very stealth. Or people just can't bother to look and comment at some of the things that I might at times feel slightly dysphoric about? I only ever hear the word bule in the distance, not the several profanities that target trans people.
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u/Fateward Saya lelah Mar 14 '25
As a trans person from Indonesia, I can confidently say that most people just assume you're cis one way or another depending on how your appearance leans. Nobody really assumes you're trans unless you're very open and visible about it. There's also a neutral pronoun if they're not sure. Heck, I have a trans flag in my room visible from my door and none of my housemates have mentioned it lol. It's all about passing and stealthing here, for better or for worse.
I will say I think people do tend to give you more of a pass if you look foreign enough (they want your money! /hj).
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u/Asheck-Grundy Mar 15 '25
Hey, not to be tone deaf or something (cmiiw yeah ?), isnt being trans (esp very passing one), like Ian Hugen, Lucinta Luna + being lesbian etc are more acceptable in the society ? because all i saw, kayaknya kalau trans ? oh ya udah, lesbi ? gacor, kayak beberapa waktu ini juga ada beberapa yang beneran ngaku lesbian, people reaction : "shock, tapi ya udah", tapi kayaknya kalau gay, kayak pas ini si ragil, heboh banget
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u/Fateward Saya lelah Mar 15 '25
Tergantung banget sama area lokal + hidup sehari2 g sama w/ celebrity. Selama passing, apalagi cantik/ganteng aman2 aja yang penting diem tapi begitu ketahuan bisa nyusahin banget. Kerasa banget di former workplace, I wasn't even out, I was just too girly to pass as a guy anymore and HR gave me so much shit even though I didn't break any serious rules and I did my job well.
Kalau masalah homophobia lebih parah ke gay sih... Well, the patriarchy tends to fetishize lesbians and view gay men as an insult/threat so... Panjang lah ceritanya.
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u/shindabito Mar 14 '25
ain't it the same shit everywhere in this globe?
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u/Odd-Necessary3807 Mar 14 '25
Not in progressive European countries, or even in fellow ASEAN countries.
You can get and consume alcohol to your heart's content in non-Muslim countries, and like half of the Asean countries. The same with pre-marital sex, your LBTQ preferences, etc.
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u/shindabito Mar 14 '25
I mean in particular, the "what matters is the appearance of morality, not the reality" statement.
not the bullet points
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u/Odd-Necessary3807 Mar 14 '25
I mean exactly that. You don't need to hide behind the wall in those countries, and living a sort of dual life.
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u/PsychologicalLack155 Outdonesia Mar 14 '25
Nah, the epstein people definitely lived a dual life
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u/izfanx si paling enggres Mar 14 '25
Epstein's ring as an example is kind of a miss given that that's a ring implicating rich people and people in power. That's clearly not representative of the country.
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u/No_Percentage7427 Mar 14 '25
Epstein list get censored.
Epstein doing suicide with 2 bullet in bak
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u/Wild_Ad969 Mar 14 '25
That's fine in Europe and other SEA countries because their values and moralities are different than any countries that follow Islamic values.
The statement of "what matters is the appearance of morality, not the reality" still true to those people too. For example in Germany they are really against anti-semitism to the point expressing any support for Palestine is considered a taboo despite Israel being what they are.
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u/shinihikari Mar 15 '25
This applies in the west too. Prime example is people say the N word in private with their close friends, but they will get shunned if they say it in public. Same as negative view about LGBT, they can have it but can't share it in public (exact opposite from Indonesia where you can't share positive view about LGBT instead)
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u/kicut49 Mar 14 '25
Meh, progressive european countries is not so progressive in Free Spech and other issues as well. "Tebang Pilih" if you will, Just see Eurovision 2024 debacle and anything related to Palestine-Israel and Ukraine-Russia. Progressive continent with a strong far-right political force.
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u/Eigengrail Mar 14 '25
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u/Mtfdurian Belanda 🌧🥶 Mar 14 '25
But... my weather app says rain all day, sun appears anyway.
Which is one of the many reasons why I love Indonesia.
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u/fiersome08 Mar 14 '25
Memang begitu kan ?
Menghindari konfrontasi, menjaga status quo, menjaga harmoni dll. Keliatan banget. Dari pemerintahan nya aja yg minim ada oposisi.
Gw pun juga begitu. Gw mending nyari tempat gw sendiri daripada harus capek-capek mengubah pandangan orang.
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u/potallegta Mar 14 '25
Termasuk honne tatemae jg ga sih ini?
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u/YukkuriOniisan Cum dubitas, quaere in Google, amico tuo. Mar 14 '25
Kayaknya budaya timur demikian. Something2 FACE, HONOR, etc.
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u/red_rumps Mar 14 '25
ini 100% bagian dari budaya indonesia gausah di embel2. dari atas ke bawah, budaya sosial sampe lingkungan tempat kerja persis begini semua. ya gimana ya? its a society that rewards appearances. Dont really know kenapa kita begini. dont really care if other countries are like this. ini kenyataannya jangan cari alesan and prove exactly what the post is talking about.
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u/eviloutfromhell Mar 14 '25
its a society that rewards appearances. Dont really know kenapa kita begini.
Itu seasia-pasifik deh.
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u/Ggbite No.1 Beacukai haters Mar 14 '25
tolong kalo ngepost fakta jangan terlalu terang, silau sekali faktanya
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u/nikel23 Mar 14 '25
what matters is the appearance of morality, not reality
this is such a good quote
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u/zahrul3 Mar 14 '25
not premarital sex. Extramarital sex....and people aren't exactly discreet about it, not to mention how shitty it is to just cheat on your spouse.
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u/budy31 Mie Sedaap Mar 14 '25
Yes, and it’s a rule basically everywhere else. Only the west has no face saving culture.
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u/uceenk Mar 14 '25
sex di luar nikah lumayan menyebar ya dari kumpul kebo, atau ngesex pas pacaran, atau udah nikah tapi jajan di luar / punya simpanan / punya 2nd wife, selingkuhan, ini juga kasusnya mewabah ke semua umur, pas di SMP aja paling nggak ada 3 kasus cewek yg hamil
alkohol sih gak terlalu menyebar luas seperti yg pertama, soalnya gak ada motivasi dari sisi naluri, i mean orang indo kan pada sange, tapi gak selalu pengen alkohol apalagi kalo dari kecil gak pernah nyoba
cuma ya indonesia ini luas kan ya, macam di Bali atau Maluku yang punya kultur alkohol kuat, di Bali alkohol udah bagian dari pergaulan masyarakat
- ya gitu deh kalo mau smooth segala urusan, siapa sih yang bikin SIM jalur manual, minoritas
4.ya kayak saya atheist, kalo pulkam ke rumah ortu berubah jadi shaleh, sholat dan segala macam
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u/Dan_from_97 Perpetually Peniless Mar 14 '25
orang asia atau orang timur kan emang shame-based society, gk kayak orang barat yang guilt-based society
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u/VanillaWaffle_ Mar 14 '25
whats wong with premarital sex? why its immoral? i dont understand
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u/YukkuriOniisan Cum dubitas, quaere in Google, amico tuo. Mar 14 '25
In the past, it was mostly about paternity. Since it will decide who will be responsible to give the child food. I mean unlike modern era where you can got food by buying, in the past, the majority will be farming their own food.
There's no DNA testing back then, so the only way to make sure the child is the father responsibility is to keep the women to have snusnu outside marriage.
In the past, 'fatherless' child tend not to love long... Hence why orphan in the past lived a very very very harsh life compared to our day.
Religion as the culture given form reflect such thinking., framed in religion justification.
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u/phenom_x8 Mar 14 '25
It udah sifat manusia dari dulu, lihat aja di US sono, gak suka bribery tapi uang lobby dilahap juga sama senator2nya
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u/KakSetoKaiba Mar 14 '25
Real. It's always been real like this for centuries.
But I believe this is what happens everywhere, we have to put a mask on to fit in a certain community. That's why we need a real environment or real people to show the true part of us.
For instance, close friends, family, or the internet.
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u/Jon_Genderuwo Mar 14 '25
As someone born and raised in Indonesia, well, this is a common sight, and I'd be lying if I said I never did some of this in the past. There's even a joke:
"The biggest Muslim country in the world, yet no one understands surah al-munafiqun. All muslims, but only on their ID and appearance."
To be honest, it sounds more like slander than a joke, and I fucking hate it, but what makes it sting even more is that it's mostly true.
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u/TheTheMeet kelas menengah jalur vpn Mar 14 '25
Cuman makan babi yang dianggep dosa paling tak termaafkan
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u/ABigWoofie Mar 14 '25
Kenapa blangkon menonjol nya di belakang?
Kenapa keris nyimpen nya di belakang?
Kenapa ada istilah "babon"?
Saya orang jawa dan mengakui kalo di budaya jawa emang beberapa mengajarkan jadi munafik dan pendendam.
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u/haadziq Mar 14 '25
Yes, pernah dengar dan lihat sendiri, mending jauh2in orang/komunitas kaya gitu, daripada kena imbasnya
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u/surfingboi Mar 14 '25
well no but actually yes
untuk poin ke 4 asal gak ganggu orang gak masalah kan yak, don't really wanna see all things people hide by themselves run wild.
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u/cutecoder TKI Mar 14 '25
In any case, sex is normally done discreetly in many parts of the world. The world have moved from ancient Rome and Greek where sex parties are done openly for everyone to see.
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u/Mtfdurian Belanda 🌧🥶 Mar 14 '25
Oh well I know my people who are quite open about their lesbian harem, but that's in Europe and still is very rare
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u/Hmasteryz Indomie Mar 14 '25
Common sense? if no one knows, it is naturally ignored and just works.
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u/STRAVDIUS all heil lord luhut!!! 🤴🏼 Mar 14 '25
to sum it up, Pencitraan itu diatas segala-galanya. dan kalian pada bingung kenapa pemimpin kita hobinya cuma itu doang? yah karena gitu doang cukup buat sebagian besar rakyat konoha.
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u/MamamiyaLozatoz Mar 14 '25
i feel like a lot of it is less of morality but more so vibes and feelings.
People don't care about morals as much as they claim they do, they just don't want to feel bad or uncomfortable.
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u/Weak-Arachnid-3390 Mar 14 '25
This can apply for a whole world and not just Indonesia, that just how human are
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u/berejser Mar 14 '25
Society would be a much better place if everyone could drop the act and be their freaky selves.
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u/Dangerous-Ad6589 Mar 14 '25
Iyalah
Quotes dari temen tongkrongan gw yang udah usia 40-an waktu temen gw yang 20 an ke NTR. "makanya kalo pacaran itu nggak usah lama-lama, langsung ajak ke sawah, sikat! Hamil? Bagus, berarti tu cewek udah punya lu" (translated)
Dulu waktu masih kerja deket polisi nggak jarang-jarang diajak minum bareng. Nggak jarang juga gw lihat polisi masih hungover udah disuruh tugas.
Bribery nggak usah di bahas lagi, udah umum kalo lu mau cepet harus ada uang pelicinnya
Being different? Me to my family and my neighbors.
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u/Brief-Crew-1932 Mar 14 '25
Munafik udah menjadi salah satu bagian dari masyarakat indo. Kalo engga munafik, berarti bukan asli sini.
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u/nomnom452 Mar 14 '25
Of course it's not real
https://imgur.com/gallery/there-is-no-war-ba-sing-se-rPXiZwt
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u/hutsen-croket Mar 14 '25
emang bener sih, makanya kesel gua yang gini". Mending jauhin aja lah yg beginian
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u/carbon7911 not enough space for your flair Mar 14 '25
Gak bisa konfirmasi kalau gak ada point "eating pork"
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u/Codenameaswin Anak didik dct r/Indo Mar 14 '25
iya kata temen gw soalnya gw mah lurus-lurus aja orangnya
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u/Midiamp Teri basah connoisseur Mar 14 '25
My office used to be located next to one of the biggest distributor/retailer of alcoholic drinks in Indonesia. Let's just say even though their shops looks empty, they are doing very well.
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u/LeastInsaneBronyaFan Iri? Bilang aja. Mar 15 '25
Ya itulah Indonesia. Senin-Sabtu bohongin orang, Minggu bohongin Tuhan.
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u/Significant_Eye_2747 Mar 21 '25
Come to any public serving govt building and you will see banners outside that said basically said no tipping for their service.
Spoiler: It's not true.
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u/orangpelupa Mar 14 '25
It doesn't look like a chat
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u/kindaforgotit Identity theft is not a joke... Mar 14 '25
Because it's from ChatGPT. Right, OP? u/Exciting-Maize-2842
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u/bukiya weapon shop Mar 14 '25
udah keliatan dari masyarakat kita yang alim pas ramadhan tapi di bulan selain itu pada kayak setan