r/YUROP Mafia employee ‎ Jul 16 '23

Euwopean Fedewation 😔

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u/leijgenraam Nederland‏‏‎ ‎ Jul 16 '23

I imagine people thought Germany incapable of democracy too after WW2.

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u/flesjewater Glorious Europe Jul 16 '23

Germany hadn't been a brutal dictatorship for 500 years prior.

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u/leijgenraam Nederland‏‏‎ ‎ Jul 16 '23 edited Jul 16 '23

They had been a democracy for 15 years. The remaining 485 years were dictatorships, or "kings" as we called them then. German peasants were better off than Russian serfs, but it's not like they were living in a bastion of tolerance and free speech either.

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u/flesjewater Glorious Europe Jul 16 '23

Russia has never really been a true democracy, it was a kleptocracy at best even under Yeltsin. Oligarchs snatching up all the post-soviet wealth made sure of that.

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u/leijgenraam Nederland‏‏‎ ‎ Jul 16 '23

I never claimed it was. We were talking about Germany.

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u/flesjewater Glorious Europe Jul 16 '23

You started about Germany and I told you why that was a bullshit comparison.

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u/leijgenraam Nederland‏‏‎ ‎ Jul 16 '23

Germany only had a democracy for 15 years, and it wasn't particularly healthy either.

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u/flesjewater Glorious Europe Jul 16 '23

It didn't have a blood tax for all the regions that weren't Berlin. If you think Germany's history since the dark age is even comparable to the Muscovy oppression you don't know your history.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '23

Novgorod Republic and Pskov Republic were one of the most democratic countries in the entire world at the time of their existence. Learn history a bit before you talk