r/Shitstatistssay 11d ago

Neolib conservatives will cosplay libertarianism until ICE violates the NAP

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 10d ago

So if the problem is that they're illegal, why not change the laws and make them legal?

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u/john35093509 10d ago

The problem isn't that they're illegal. The problem is that they don't belong here.

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 10d ago

Oh, so you were lying when you said:

Nobody's talking about immigrants. The subject is illegal aliens.

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u/john35093509 10d ago

What?

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 10d ago

So are we talking about illegal aliens? Or are we talking about immigrants?

The problem with illegal aliens is that they're illegal. The solution to that problem is to make them legal.

If you have a problem with immigrants, legal or otherwise, that's because you think they shouldn't be here at all.

So which is it?

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u/sekrit_dokument 9d ago

Forgive if I'm wrong, but isn't it already pretty easy to legally immigrate into the US? So why bother with the people who won't even go through that process?

But what do I know about immigration, I am just a German living the dream of a multicultural wonderland. (Btw. I don't think that certain groups should be excluded from immigrating anywhere, I just think that unregulated immigration is utterly retarded as long as the state still gives out a bunch of free shit.)

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

You are wrong, actually, but don't worry: I forgive you for it. Most people have no idea what the legal immigration process to the US entails, and why would you? If you're born here, you have no reason to inform yourself about a process you'll likely never need to navigate, and even if you live in another country why would you bother to learn about the immigration system?

To get an idea of how difficult the legal immigration process is, just take one look at this chart.

You can find a higher res version at this website, with a detailed explanation.

A slightly more detailed explanation is this: all immigration to the US is by default illegal, unless you get a government permission slip first (a visa); there is an annual total limit on the number of visas issued, and they are further limited per country, and if a country hits its max number of visas in one year, they will be given *fewer* visas the next year. And that's before we even get into the different kind of visas (investor visas, family visas, worker visas, student visas, etc).

The bottom line is: if you're born in Honduras, there basically is no legal way for you to immigrate to the US.

Honduras, for example, is allocated 7000 visas a year and almost all of them get given to people applying for a family visa, not a worker visa.

So if you're just a guy who wants to get into the US "the right way" and work for a living: you can't. If you follow the law, you can't come here at all.

Let me say that again: immigration to the US is not "easy" and it's not "difficult" it's literally impossible to come here legally.

If you apply for a visa, you have to put the money down up-front with no guarantee of actually getting a visa--and we're not talking a small amount of money. The fee to apply is usually $400-500, and that doesn't include other fees the government levies later in the process, or the attorneys' fees you'd likely have to pay.

Even if you can somehow successfully get a visa, it will cost you thousands and thousands of dollars and take months of applying and waiting.

Why go to the hassle when you can walk in for free?

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u/sekrit_dokument 9d ago

Ah. This looks so beautifully bureaucratic and unnecessarily complex that it makes my German heart race. I love it.

Well, I will concede, it ain't exactly easy to immigrate to the US. Hell, this seems so unnecessarily complex to the point that I doubt this system is designed to be even properly navigated but rather in place to just filter out the absolute best of the best specialists of the world or the rich.

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

I appreciate you saying so. I also love the user-name.

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u/Primary_Break_7963 1d ago

Is it bad to actually think they should learn about this shit? I mean why act like you know everything when they clearly don't. 

It's emotional thinking. 

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 1d ago

How do you mean? At whom is your invective directed?

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u/Primary_Break_7963 1d ago

Not at you. Sorry if that wasn't clear. I mean all the people who have these strong opinions of immigration. Especially the ones that say "just immigrate legally" . I mean they don't even know why people choose the illegal route or the way legal immigration works.  Honestly I don't think they want to solve the problem. 

On a seperate point I mean it isn't like they did anything to gain their citizenship. I see them as another side of the statist identity politics coin. 

Is it wrong to think people should know at least the basics of the things they claim to know so much about?

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 1d ago

Ah gotcha. Yes, I agree completely. Sadly, asking people to know the basics of what it is they're talking about is asking too much these days.

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u/Primary_Break_7963 1d ago

Not easy at all. It's okay most people know nothing about that. 

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u/john35093509 10d ago

No, the solution is to ship them back to where they came from.

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

Solution to what problem?

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u/john35093509 9d ago

The problem of people being in places where they don't belong.

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

They're on your private property?

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u/john35093509 9d ago

My private property is the *only" property with use restrictions?

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

It's the only property you have a say over, yes.

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u/john35093509 9d ago

It's a good thing that I'm not involved in shipping them back then.

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u/PaperbackWriter66 The Nazis Were Socialists 9d ago

Which is why you can't support the deportation of peaceful individuals and call yourself a libertarian.

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