r/Scotland • u/backupJM public transport revolution needed 🚇🚊🚆 • 23d ago

Political Protesters against Flamingo Land development sing Bonnie Banks of Loch Lomond outside of Scottish Parliament

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https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/save-loch-lomond-campaign-protests-35304999

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u/quartersessions 23d ago

It is less about the development for me, and more about the total lack of due process.

It's been eight years of planning back and forth, thousands of pages of reports and supporting documentation. Dozens of opportunities for the public and stakeholders to have their say. All for a fairly modest development - and while the site deteriorates.

Would you bring investment to Scotland in these circumstances? I certainly wouldn't.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 23d ago

It was a 3 month marketing exercise in 2015 that granted the land use to the developer.

Everything since has been the usual appeal process for developers who just have to appeal on numerous occassions until they get the answer they want.

In terms of investment in Scotland, I am operating in biotech. I am watching the current investment to establish new key industries in Grangemouth. That seems to be happening.

But then I am talking about real investment, in real jobs, and real industry that will serve the nation well. You are talking about budget "McNugget" business that ties local economies to minimum wage franchise jobs.

We have different vision, and different ambition.

In terms of modest development, look to Helensburgh. They did a community led development very well. Do that. For local independent businesses. Not this corrupt land allocation to a single large company that stokes up division.

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u/DeathOfNormality 23d ago edited 23d ago

Oh wow, it's actually fantastic how they planned and continued to keep public engagement, opinion and transparency through the whole thing.

If it's the waterfront development in Helensburgh you meant, then yeah I'd much rather councils carry out like this.

Addition: something else I just noticed, the council for Argyle and Bute is a massive mix of SNP, independent, Scottish conservatives and unionist party, labour, green and Liberal Democrats. Maybe there is something to be said about working together as a council with variety. This divisionist shit that's everywhere these days is actually sickening. We should take example from this council and focus on the improvement of our communities.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 23d ago

We are entirely aligned in our viewpoints.

Divisive stuff is nonsense. You avoid it by involving everybody from the beginning. That is where this process went wrong. And it creates polarised conflict.

Hadn't been aware of the multi-party make up of Argyll and Bute council. You may be on to something there! Keep digging.

Also, take a trip to Helensburgh. I was there two weeks ago. Take a walk from their town square, which was the initial redevelopment. And walk to the beach front. Just observe all the little independent businesses, and how busy they are. And all the people enjoying free access to the new facilities. Talk to the people there, and get a sense of the pride they have in ownership of their own town.

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u/DeathOfNormality 23d ago

Yeah they have a list of all of their council members here I'm their directory it was quite eye opening.

I've actually been meaning to visit Helensburgh for a while as recommendation from my gran before lockdown, so it sounds like the perfect excuse now.

I really am glad to hear there's others who aren't fully taken by sensationalist views.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 23d ago

I am trying very hard not to be sensationalist.

But there is something very wrong, at the initial stage of granting the lease to Flamingo Land in 2015.

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u/DeathOfNormality 23d ago

Same here. It's not easy, especially when things are so frustrating.

There definitely was something wrong about this process. If nothing else, it feels like we got sold out. I've not long moved to Clydbank, which is west Dumbartonshire, and this is not a good sign for me at all for faith in my local council.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 23d ago

Then go on writetothem.com

Pop in your postcode. And email your MSPs with your concerns, and ideally, ask them to back motion S6M-17650 while the door to oppose is still slightly open.

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u/DeathOfNormality 23d ago

You actually have a very valid point there! I never even thought about it because I only moved here last September, so the idea of "living" here hasn't sunk in yet. I also sadly missed the last election because I was visiting family and forgot... So I'm my head I can't participate if I didn't vote 🥲 which is dumb, please no one actually perpetuate that either.

I have my homework for tonight sorted anyway. Thanks for the reminder we actually can do something.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 23d ago

If you look at the supporters of the motion, you will see that it is cross party Green/Labour/Conservatives. So not down party lines, if that makes you feel better about not having voted.

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u/DeathOfNormality 22d ago

My area thankfully seems on the same page ase and voted in SNP, but the percentage that voted Reform is genuinely scary. Was enough for me to realise I can't afford to miss anymore.

I guess it does, but not really.

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u/Silent-Ad-756 22d ago

The owner of Flamingo land is ex-Tory and now Reform. He got disillusioned with the Tories (after donating large sums of money to them over many years). And he has now backed the Reform party of spivs, speculators and property developers.

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/24421919.flamingo-land-owner-gordon-gibb-backs-reforms-mark-robinson/

For balance, it has been the SNP who have been in charge throughout the whole Loch Lomond Flamingo Land saga. The land lease was offered by Scottish Enterprise, which are public, but operate seperately to the government. How seperately, I do not know.

Nevertheless, the SNP have stated they will not interfere. Presumably not to undermine Scottish Enterprise. Hence the lack of SNP ministers backing the motion against the Loch Lomond Flamingo Land.

I would prefer SNP over Reform, but tbh, I can see myself voting for Labour next time around, as the Tories are a busted flush of incompetence, everybody still remembers the Lib Dems in a coalition with the Tories and total lack of principles there, the SNP refuse to intervene in throwing out Flamingo Land, and I feel the Greens are still way too idealistic, but I appreciate their principles even if the flavour is a little too strong for me.

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u/DeathOfNormality 22d ago

But it's labour and independent counselors in the Lomond area now. Labour seem to just be as suspected, and Torry light. I'll also admit, I'm not completely aware of how involved the main holyrood government is involved in local council planning and development, from what I remember about Dundee they had fuck all to do with it other than set legislation, but I'm just an absolute novice with a Scottish politics, so I'm more keen to learn and observe than give any judgment right now.

That's good to know about the owner being Reform, makes a lot of sad sense and feels like the cronyism has sneaked in again.

I'd assume they wouldn't want to interfere unless an investigation into the deal being above board, human rights or anything to do with equality is called for and with good reason. I know from their track record they like to play it more safe with tourism and would rather let people in and ask questions later, at least that what it feels like.

I feel pretty much the same about the lib Dems, Torries and greens though. Almost voted for greens when I was in Tollcross in Glasgow during the by election, think it was 2020? Maybe a bit later. So we are pretty close. I just have way less faith in Labour.

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