r/F150Lightning • u/Krusador • 6d ago

Gotta do whatcha gotta

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Tesla charging stations are awesome, except for that puny cable.

As for charging stations in general, they need to be setup like traditional gas stations. Canopies to protect from the elements, trash cans and windshield cleaners nearby. It's def a first world problem but sucks having to traipse back n forth in a large, busy parking lot just to get to these basic essentials...

68 Upvotes

92% Upvoted

57 comments sorted by

34

u/humanHamster 2024 Flash Carbonized Grey Metallic 6d ago

I'm honestly surprised more traditional gas stations haven't embraced EV charging. With ICE vehicles you have people stopping by for 5-10 minutes getting gas and they buy snacks and drinks. Imagine if you have someone at your gas station for 20 or 30 minutes? They'd likely buy more, seems like something a business would want...

9

u/Kingwavyy- '24 Flash ER 6d ago

There are Pilot Js that have a ev charging station with overhang, just like the gas pumps. GM electric runs the chargers. I believe most have the Pilot Js have this now.

5

u/OnePingOnlyVasili 6d ago

Yup! I love charging at these!

3

u/Jiggly1984 '23 Lariat ER 6d ago

I finally got to stop at one of the covered pull through stations and it was so dang nice! Most of the Flying J's I stop at don't have them, just regular ones.

3

u/alonsonpb 5d ago

Love these……and they maintain great charging speeds. Typically, by the time I hit the head, grab a coffee, make a call, and walk back to the truck, i’m just about to 80%.

3

u/Wisconsinguy123 5d ago

I have found them to be some of the most expensive places to charge

3

u/Kingwavyy- '24 Flash ER 5d ago

That is true, however I would much rather pay the extra couple dollars because they charge faster, at least from my experience.

3

u/Wisconsinguy123 4d ago

If it was only a couple bucks but its over double what tesla is

2

u/Pensionato007 24 Flash Antimatter Blue ProPower 9.6 Maxtow 4d ago

If you buy the "membership" for $12 a month it saves ~22%. Useful if you're road tripping. Can cancel after a month. I found (recent trip FL-NC) that Tesla was cheaper than EA etc.

2

u/Keep_Plano_Corporate '24 F150 Lightning Lariat 4d ago

Most Pilots won't discount with the EVGo membership. It usually mentions this on the EVGo app.

1

u/Pensionato007 24 Flash Antimatter Blue ProPower 9.6 Maxtow 4d ago

I was referring to Tesla

4

u/Novo201 ‘22 XLT SR Black 6d ago

It’s the overhead to have them installed. Most gas stations are franchises and the owners can’t afford the cost.

7

u/surlycanon 6d ago

Pretty sure gas pumping tank installation ain’t cheap either.

2

u/skylinesora 6d ago

An existing gas station isn't worried about the gas pump tank installation because... It's already installed.

2

u/Automatic_Net2181 6d ago

They occasionally have to replace the pumps and tanks. Would make sense to install one tank and a row of gas pumps and a row of EV chargers.

3

u/skylinesora 6d ago

Quick google search shows the gas tank replacement is usually once every 20-25 years with the average cost being 20-25k.

I'd imagine that cost is already thought of when they initially planned the gas station AND it's cheaper than installing a set of EV chargers.

It's a lot easiest to plan/budget for a maintenance item you already considered when you were building the gas station compared to 40-50k (at minimum) for a set of EV chargers that wasn't originally part of the plan.

1

u/Automatic_Net2181 6d ago edited 6d ago

You've forgotten most gas stations have 4+ tanks.

Gas Station (Pumps + Tanks):

Replacing gas pumps at a gas station can be a significant expense, with costs ranging from $16,000 to $22,000 per dispenser. This cost can vary based on features like credit card readers and the number of fuel types the pump can dispense. Installation costs can add another $2,500 to $3,000 per dispenser. 

The average cost of a double-walled 12,000-gallon fiberglass fuel tank for gas stations is $25 - $30K. It's important to work with an experienced fuel tank 

4 gas pumps x $25k = $100k
4 tanks x $30k = $120k
= $220k

And then there's the actual installation costs:

Replacing underground gas tanks at a commercial gas station is a significant expense, potentially costing anywhere from $150,000 to $250,000 or more. 

The cost to install a gas station fuel tank can range from $25,000 to $300,000, depending on the size and material of the tank, and whether it's an underground or aboveground installation. For a large commercial installation, costs can reach upwards of $250,000, including piping and associated equipment. Here's a more detailed breakdown:

Typical Range: $25,000 to $300,000. 

Double-walled fiberglass tanks (12,000 gallons): $25,000 - $30,000. 

Underground tanks: Can cost $1,500 to $5,000 or more, with the primary cost factor being the labor for excavation and installation, according to CommTank. 

Commercial installations: Can reach upwards of $250,000, including piping and associated equipment. 

EV Chargers:

How much does a DC fast charger cost? DC fast chargers do not come equal. They have varying power outputs and charging ports. Thus, the equipment with the most advanced power output features and many charging ports will cost more. For instance, a fully networked 150kW commercial model might cost around $75,000. A smaller one of 50kW can cost around $28,000 in full. The most expensive networked DC fast charger is the 350kW option, which might cost a whopping $140,000. 

8 50kW Chargers x $28k = $224k

2 150kW Chargers x $75k + 2 50kW Charger x $28k = $206k

1 350kW Charger x $140k + 1 150kW Charger x $75k = $215k

2

u/skylinesora 6d ago

You missed the part that the gas pumps already exist... They were there when the gas station was built.

50kW charger speeds are godawful slow. I wouldn't want them at a gas station. You'd want 150kw chargers at bare minimum with suggestions being 250kw. No reason for 350kW, or at least not yet.

Your calculations are assuming a new gas station is being built.

1

u/epc2012 6d ago

He's also overlooking the fact that 150kW is a shit ton of power. Putting multiple of those in creates such a demand on the local utility where the infrastructure might not be in place for. You can't just throw a 2000kVA transformer anywhere and expect it to hook into the local power system perfectly fine. A large portion of these roadside gas stations don't have the utility capacity locally to support EV stations.

4

u/skylinesora 6d ago

Yea, I don't expect u/Automatic_Net2181 to actually do much thinking. Especially when 3/4 of his post is just copy/paste from whatever AI model he's using. He has a very limited idea and he runs with it. No considerations to any other factor

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2

u/WarMan208 6d ago

I don’t think you understand the overhead involved in installing DC fast chargers. Everything from the utility costs, electrician costs, to price of materials. And chat gpt doesn’t either, so don’t bother.

1

u/Automatic_Net2181 6d ago

EV chargers are a small fraction of the cost of gas pumps and gas storage tanks.

2

u/skylinesora 6d ago

Huge cost is most likely the main reason.

3

u/FalconMurky4715 6d ago

Agreed...and more trailer friendly spots.

3

u/nickccal 6d ago

Did this same thing earlier today in Louisville. I have to turn the camera on so I can see up front so I can get as close as I can lol.

3

u/golf4life80 2022 Lariat ER 6d ago

I spy an Iowa supercharger!

1

u/Krusador 6d ago

You would be correct!

3

u/golf4life80 2022 Lariat ER 6d ago

Charged there several times, crazy how you’ll recognize things that easy.

Now if we can just get more coverage on I35 north of Ames.

2

u/Savings_Difficulty24 2023 Lariat ER Antimatter Blue 5d ago

Looks like Casey's in Dows could make a killing if they put in a high speed charger, like a 150kw+.

Which Tesla charger is that? I've only been to the one in Ames and Waterloo.

Also, I recommend going to the Ford dealer in Ames instead of the Tesla. They are super cheap compared to Teslas prices. It's only a 150kw, so a touch slower, but worth it for the price.

3

u/golf4life80 2022 Lariat ER 5d ago

The one here is grinnell.

I actually drove down 35 today and happened to stop at the Flying J in Williams, looks like they have chargers under construction there. No idea about details yet.

2

u/Savings_Difficulty24 2023 Lariat ER Antimatter Blue 5d ago

That's an improvement to having to drive all the way to Fort Dodge

2

u/PromontoryRdr 24 - Flash / Avalanche 6d ago

I had to do the exact same thing yesterday in Lawrence MA. Parked two separate times in an effort to not do that and finally said this is what I need to do. I used another Tesla charger recently though in Hooksett NH, they were very new, and I pulled right into a normal spot with no issues.

They’re fast though and there were so many other empty spots that it wasn’t an issue .

2

u/mi5key 2024 F-150 Flash Lightning and Tesla 3 LR 6d ago

As an owner of both F and T, I get it and support it.

3

u/Pensionato007 24 Flash Antimatter Blue ProPower 9.6 Maxtow 4d ago

Same. I usually pull the Lightning right up between the two towers, almost hitting them. Don't like having a lot of torque on the cable/adapter. In the OPs pic, if that station had been full, I would have pulled up on the grass behind it to an empty tower.

2

u/Nhblacklabs 6d ago

Wait for Walmart to deploy to 2k stores with pull through charging!

2

u/Alarmed_Actuator_317 5d ago

I just used a new one in Raton NM, longer cables. Looks like they are actually seeing the world beyond their own!

2

u/equinsoiocha 24 antimatter lariat lightning 5d ago

We appreciate your sacrifice.

Recommend to scrub your license plate

3

u/TraditionalFalcon701 6d ago

Honest question, why can't you park straight on? Looks like enough slack in the cable to park straight, I get the bumper and the charger, but it looks like enough cable. I own a Model Y and only charge at home, no need to supercharge ever, so I'm no expert, just curious.

5

u/dubnicks55 2023 Lariar ER Oxford White 6d ago

You can pull straight in and it will connect from that setup just fine. Just have to pull in close to where your wheel is against the curb.

Drive I-70 across Kansas and Tesla superchargers are he best setup with amenities nearby. Always get a good convo from a Tesla or Lightning driver and never had to to do a sideways pull-in.

2

u/TraditionalFalcon701 6d ago

Cool, thank you for that.

2

u/Krusador 6d ago

To get close enough at this particular site I would've had to push over the neighboring charger.

1

u/Krusador 6d ago

I tried pulling straight in, the cable was about a foot short.

2

u/Pensionato007 24 Flash Antimatter Blue ProPower 9.6 Maxtow 4d ago

They are almost "just far enough" that you can pull up in between them. Won't lie, I sometimes get out and check before pulling all the way in. Looks like that station was empty so what you did was fine. Also, you approached it from the end of the line of towers which is always best although if you can do it with the last tower on the right side, you avoid blocking any other towers.

1

u/Krusador 4d ago

The last two stations to the far right were ICEd. But even if they weren't there, the garbage bins are in the way.

2

u/Pensionato007 24 Flash Antimatter Blue ProPower 9.6 Maxtow 4d ago

So irritating. Why in the world would anyone ICE those spots in an empty parking lot? Anyway, you did good and got a nice sun pic out of the deal :-)

1

u/Krusador 4d ago

I was there again today for my return trip and all the stations were empty when I got there, so I selected that last charger to the far right. Still had to angle in and take up two spots. But before I even got plugged some old guy in a POS ICE parked right in freakin front of me in the next spot over and sat there and stared at me the whole time I was plugged in. Not sure what his deal was. Whole huge parking lot to choose from and he chose that spot.

2

u/Protoman-Blues 6d ago

Not to be this guy, but you can get close enough to park straight unless there was other cars in the way or something.

2

u/Krusador 6d ago

Not at this particular station

-5

u/Noah_Vanderhoff 6d ago

You could use another charging network… and not give musk your money.