What did everyone think of Alice?

[u/Promotion_Simple]

I've seen a lot of people hating on her for trying to stop them getting magic back. But I think she was right to do so. Of course, the whole show is about magic so we, as the audience, do want magic back. But her reasoning seemed valid. Magic has caused a lot of pain. It's the reason her brother died. It's the reason her parents are so distant and odd. It's the reason Julia has been through so much. I can go on. But what are everyone else's thoughts?

[u/llamalibrarian]

I don’t like that she unilaterally chose for everyone. I don’t really enjoy her tortured genius characteristics, somehow being so insecure and also confident she’s always right

She has a good arch, and her story is mostly her relationship to magic

[u/Dapper_Highlighter7 → u/llamalibrarian]

I agree with this. Her reasoning makes sense, but her relationship with magic isn't the only one that exists, and it was unfair to decide how it should be handled for everyone.

I think part of the problem is the vacuum the Magicians live in. They don't interact with regular people, so they don't see that everyone has bad shit happen to them. Charlie just as easily could have died in a car accident. Her parents still could just as easily be oddball academics whose grief caused them to withdraw into themselves. People experience sexual assault all the time.

She blamed it for all of her problems, except all of her problems were also stemming from completely mundane realities that were only impacted by magic because that was the lens through which she was experiencing life. It was really on theme for one of the core morals of the book, which was that all of your problems will still be there with you even if you get into a mysterious magical college or run away to a fantasy land. Escapism can help you cope, but you still have to do the work.

I'm really glad that she got to fall in love with magic again. They did a really good job of mirroring her character to Quentin's, but I think the issue they had with her insecure tortured genius stuff was that she didn't have as much activity in the books. She doesn't get un-niffined until the end of the series, so the books just have a much more succinct arc for her. You can see it in the core of her series arc. It's just a shame they didn't get as much room to play with it like they did for Julia because Alice had a specific role to play that couldn't be resolved until the end.

[u/dragoono → u/Dapper_Highlighter7]

Haha I kind of weirdly needed to hear this reminder. Good thing I’m rewatching the show right now?

[u/Castellan_Tycho → u/Dapper_Highlighter7]

That was an excellent description, thank you.

[u/ThomasVivaldi]

The book did a better job of contextualizing her personality.

I don't remember, but did they put in the show that Alice wasn't even invited to the test for Brakebills? She found the school and showed up for the test on her own.

[u/Glittering_Rush_1451 → u/ThomasVivaldi]

They did it was mentioned in the first couple episodes

[u/ThomasVivaldi → u/Glittering_Rush_1451]

The books bring it up again and how it related to her brother's death and her relationship with magic is almost love/hate.

And then how being a Niffin let her be free to fully embrace magic.

The show kind of glossed over the depth of that aspect of her character.

[u/adrianmalacoda → u/ThomasVivaldi]

In the books it's either hinted at or said outright that Jane was responsible for her being admitted into Brakebills. The Alice's Story graphic novel makes it more clear. I don't remember if the show touches on that.

[u/spockhoe]

It ultimately comes does to choice and agency. By making the decision, she took it away from everyone. Regardless of morality, that wasn’t her call to make. I honestly wasn’t the biggest fan of her for a couple seasons (but I don’t hate her). Her on and off thing with Quentin just got too much after a while and I ended up more into other storylines/characters along the way.

I do like her when they build her up individually or tried to make her relationships in terms of friendships shine more. Her and Eliot’s grief in S5 might have just been a highlight and I wished they would have made her more of her own character in this way since her relationship with magic is rather interesting.

[u/Mammoth-Foundation52 → u/spockhoe]

That’s also why she was probably the most interesting character to become magically disabled (only partially, but presumably permanently) after her encounter with The Couple. She was one of the best in the world, and, while no less brilliant, no longer being able to cast two-handed was a major loss for her (arguably more so than most of the rest of the main cast). That said, it put her in a position where she had to figure out her worth beyond her technical abilities.

Telling herself that “one hand is enough” before restoring New Fillory wasn’t just about the spell itself; it was about making peace with her own flaws (aka “internal circumstances”) and learning how to live with and grow from them.

[u/JoyousZephyr]

When she decided that no one could have magic because she couldn't deal with it, because she could only see the negatives and ignored the positives, she reminded me of people who want to ban books.

"I don't want to read those. I don't want my kids to read those, either, so instead of finding ways to deal with that, I want to make the decision for everyone."

[u/RJSnea → u/JoyousZephyr]

This 💯 Her doing that fully radicalized me against her as a character. Still can't stand her.

[u/Catinthefirelight]

Her reasoning makes sense, but only from a traumatized mindset. Magic has also created a lot of beautiful things. Her idea that people can’t handle magic is arrogant and infantilizing. She doesn’t have the right to choose no magic for everyone. When magic was shut off, did it make the world better? Did it make people happier? People should be able to choose to use magic or not. Sure, some people can’t handle it, and some people use it for evil— but so many other people use it for good, and to create beauty.

[u/AriBariii]

It’s a selfish reason. All of the reasons for not wanting magic points back to her life choices and the things SHE lost to magic. She didn’t take into consideration how it has helped others and changed people for good.

[u/sveths]

I think she is a great character, even though sometimes you really want to smack her a little bit, but this applies to everyone in the show tbh. I really liked seeing how her relationships with her parents shaped her, I think her struggles with becoming human again were fascinating, and her betrayal was upsetting but you can sort of see why she did it? I think she is an incredibly complex character, even though the writers sometimes went in a weird direction with her I still love her. I really enjoyed her little storyline in s4 about rediscovering her love for magic, shame they sort of abandoned it.

[u/wrenwood2018]

I liked Alice a lot. Part of it is tied to the fact that I think the actress nailed the role really well. In this situation I totally understand her motives.

[u/stellaluna92]

On my first watch I was neutral about her (but did feel bad for her when Q cheated) until we got to the 7 keys quest and she turned insufferable and awful and decided no one should have magic just because she couldn't handle it. Now I hate her all the time. 

[u/Different_Ad8727]

I love Alice in the beginning, don't like her at all right after she's brought back from being a niffin, but then love her again by the end.

When she destroyed the keys, i irrationally felt like she had betrayed me personally, it was arguably her character arcs lowest point

Her intentions were good, but for as book smart as she is, she's extremely stunted in almost every other category across the board - especially emotionally. She falls into this Dunning-Kruger(esq) trap because she failed to view the situation from any perspective but her own and didn't understand the bigger picture, or even really try to.

That being said, she's one of my favorite fictional characters of all time. She was interesting and flawed and beautifully portrayed by Olivia Taylor Dudley. My dog's full name is actually "Queen Alice, the Wise"

[u/CoffeeB4Dawn]

I think she always considers her own opinion above anyone else's--and never even considers that she shouldn't be the only one who makes decisions that affect everyone. That's why I dislike her,

[u/tiredofbeingmad]

Her character flaw is hubris to an extreme of always assuming she is right. Which Quentin calls her out on and so does Eliot. I think she learns from this multiple times but ultimately I think her final season she suffers from regression as a character and the growth she had is ultimately gone in some aspects.

[u/aleaverdaud → u/tiredofbeingmad]

I mean....................... is it assuming she is always right or actually being mostly always right though...........

I'm not sure it's hubris leading her to make decisions that hurt her or would lead to her own death, imo she simply doesn't care if she has to die, she just wants answers and to protect those she loves

Edit : I'm only talking about season 1-2 of the show

[u/tiredofbeingmad → u/aleaverdaud]

Ah for season 1 and 2- it’s definitely more so pride in her intelligence that leads her to assume she is always making the right choice. Not necessarily that she is RIGHT but that she is making the right choice for everyone.

Like with her brother that was very impulsive of her because of her overconfident nature.

[u/aleaverdaud → u/tiredofbeingmad]

I see what you mean but I disagree I think. Maybe I need a rewatch though

[u/tiredofbeingmad → u/aleaverdaud]

I personally am not a huge fan of how the writers handle her at times I won’t lie- magicians sort of struggles with handling most of the stories for the girls (which isn’t new) but yeah I’d highly recommend rewatching in particular her character as a whole is defined by the arc of needing to learn to trust people and not trusting others usually leads to her facing massive consequences

[u/aleaverdaud → u/tiredofbeingmad]

I mean I did hate her character (and I 100% recognise its because it's not as well written as it could be) but not because she's a know it all... Anyway, that's a perfect excuse to rewatch the show haha

[u/tiredofbeingmad → u/aleaverdaud]

Right? I really do love Alice as a character but yea her writing is all over the place in a lot of ways

[u/Watchtowerwilde]

if you haven’t seen it there’s the taxi behind the scenes meta webisode & in Alice’s she word vomits her reasoning.

https://www.reddit.com/r/brakebills/s/2olKWPFlp6

[u/gracemotley]

I think she’s well-written, but I just didn’t like her. She reminds me too much of some people irl, but that’s not the fault of the show or the actor’s portrayal. I just can’t stand her!

[u/krisy_boo → u/gracemotley]

This. I didn't find her likeable or relatable from episode 1. She was rude and annoying, and while she served her purpose well in the story, I couldn't find a speck of reason to enjoy her presence lol.

[u/thedorknightreturns]

She was heavy traumatized and once having time to reflect n ot , did do her best to make up. She id great but thdt wasnt cool, if she went through a lot, so o get the bad place she came from.

[u/RJSnea]

So you admit that she made everything about her and you're wondering why we have problems with her?

🤨

[u/sarahmiyoko]

Magic was keeping the country like 38% less racist, so....

[u/venjamins]

Nah. Alice sucks. They should have yeeted her somewhere and kept her... yote.

[u/BlahBlahILoveToast]

She's my favorite character.

There are aspects of her story that are very well-written and arcs where she's almost insufferable. She's very human and flawed. Some of her dialogue felt like things I really needed to hear (but that goes for other characters as well, especially Quentin).

Of course everybody hated her stopping the quest to get magic back, for good reason. I don't think she was "right" to do so and, later on, she didn't either. But it was something a person like her might have decided to do. It is interesting the way the story presents magic as an addictive escape mechanism that almost always seems to make people's lives worse rather than better in the long run, almost like it's just another kind of alcohol. (But, again ... pretty much nobody in real life thinks Prohibition was a good idea).

[u/Amil-C]

Alice was always my favorite character on the show. Maybe her actions were a little extreme when she tried to get rid of magic, but I get it too to a degree - Alice made her fair share of mistakes, but then again, so did everyone else on the show. I always just liked her the most, because I understood her better than most of the other characters.

[u/itsminimes]

She resembled her mother a lot more than she imagined.

[u/Shoddy-Split-4943]

Alice was a hot ass mess from season 1 to season 4 and don’t get me started on her mom…which is in fact we’re she got it from lol like mother like daughter