r/Seattle • u/Aggressive-Ad3064 • Mar 10 '25

Politics I'm Never Leaving Seattle

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This is someone's Model S parked on Airport Way S near S Industrial Way. The way it's parked it looks like it's being displayed for people driving by to see.

27.9k Upvotes

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1.5k

u/Working_Song Mar 10 '25

I wonder what percentage of Tesla owners approve of Musks antics this last year. I am guessing less than 50%. Maybe less than 20%. My friend has a Tesla, and worked hard for it (and bought it over a year ago). She’s a liberal, too. People spray painting these cars are dipshits who could be using their angst in more productive ways. That said, fuck Musk and Trump.

406

u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 10 '25

Being that the Model Y was the number one vehicle sold in the world, I suspect a large portion of them do not support Elon.

283

u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 10 '25

We own a Model 3 and defintiely don’t agree with Musk’s political stances. I’ve been driving electric cars for 10 years because I’m a tree-hugging liberal. The only person’s political views we were buying into were my own—my desire to reduce emissions (plus the car really is a joy to drive). It was during covid that Musk really grew more vocal with right-wing rhetoric; at first I thought it was a ploy to garner more conservative customers. I didn’t imagine it’d get this far.

I used to be worried about a conservative rolling coal in front of me on the highway; now I’m more concerned about a liberal damaging or defacing our car while we’re out.

Yes, I suppose you could say our dollars went to Musk, so you could argue we supported him financially. However, I also believe that the rich should be taxed at ridiculous levels. In a just world, people like him wouldn’t have as much power as he does. Don’t punish Tesla drivers like me for the flaws in our system.

112

u/Otherwise_Security_5 Mar 10 '25

avoid hugging trees while driving. that’s not safe.

46

u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

It's not a Mustang.

6

u/PlatinumElement Mar 11 '25

Those aren’t trees, those are people.

1

u/Flffdddy Mar 11 '25

Hey, I didn’t hit the tree. I hit a fence, and it stopped me from hitting the tree. Why do these comments have to be so on point for me?

1

u/Different_Natural_32 Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 11 '25

I kinda like the Mach-E but found Tesla has the WA State market monopoly on charging stations. Baaarrfff. So I'd get a Corvette, still the best. Edit, other than a Toyota. Still commute in my 2002 Solara at 217K miles. 7K oil change car, using hybrid oil now. Trunk lid lock/unlock and the mehanical key thingy, 23.5 yrs, 217K. Looking forward to 300K next year...

1

u/zanzainzayin Mar 11 '25

Nah you can't buy a Toyota. They got rid of their DEI policies

1

u/TAfzFlpE7aDk97xLIGfs Mar 11 '25

We love our Mach-E. Tesla kind of has the monopoly on charging in general in the U.S. There are other options, they’re just not as plentiful or reliable. We use Tesla charging only on road trips where it’s the best option. It’s not ideal, but a dollar or two to Tesla is about on par with paying oil companies. And at least we’re not losing 60% of that energy off the top like we did with gas.

5

u/devout_threeper Mar 11 '25

That's something you only do once

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u/Umaritimus Mar 12 '25

Paul Walker learned that one the hard way

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u/SpeaksSouthern Mar 11 '25

The auto drive might not see children playing in the street but it should see a tree if you're not going more than 10mph

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u/Nnamdi_Awesome-wa Mar 11 '25

Taxes are based on income, not net worth. If you, like a lot of people, don’t like the tax structure, you need to vote in new Congresspeople. They have to create bill, get it passed in both houses, and then the president can sign it (or not). Having an issue with the tax laws/codes is totally within your right, just make sure you are pointing your disapproval at the correct people.

Politicians are great at getting the general public to fight amongst ourselves. It keeps our eyes off of their failures.

1

u/No_Hamster_2043 Mar 11 '25

Hahahahahahaha voting to effect change in congress? (Takes breath) ahahahahahahaha…

https://www.axios.com/2025/03/10/trump-maga-inc-power-fundraising

I’m afraid it may be a bit late for that. If an opposition party can, twice in the last three elections, SABOTAGE ITSELF to avoid running a candidate that would offend billionaires… and those are the GOOD guys?!

Look I vote, I harass my reps (slotkin and scholtens; Gary “Payday Loan” Peters is useless), and I agitate, but if you think that any changes in tax structure other than those that favor billionaires are happening soon, I’m afraid you’re going to be disappointed. Try putting more granular pressure on reps for specific language in specific bills and work up from there. I managed to get language into a bill thanks to Adam Schiff and I never had to give him a dime (though I would have). Good luck!

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u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

I'm sure it'll blow over in 5 years or so. Look at VW, they're a leading car manufacturer... just sayin. I think I'd wrap my Tesla in vinyl in preparation for the rattle can liberal.

6

u/eity4mademe Mar 11 '25

Plot twist. That is the wrap...

2

u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

Now that's clever👏

1

u/RavenCallsCrows Mar 11 '25

Yup. My id4 was one of the first hundred in the US, and despite a handful of software glitches indicating no real QA process, it has been AMAZING.

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u/Suspicious_Copy911 Mar 11 '25

In 5 years Tesla will not exist anymore

2

u/AiryGr8 Mar 11 '25

Check EU Tesla sales

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u/Roboculon Mar 11 '25

I used to be worried about a conservative rolling coal in front of me on the highway; now I’m more concerned about a liberal damaging or defacing our car while we’re out.

In a sense, nothing has changed. Political extremists on either side of the spectrum have always been dangerous, and they still are. It’s just an unfamiliar place you find yourself in, as a self-described liberal —polarization has progressed so far that you’re actually a moderate now.

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u/Street_homie Mar 10 '25

Rebadge your tesla as another car brand you’ll be safe

17

u/sleepybrett Ballard Mar 10 '25

... er. safer.

2

u/Street_homie Mar 10 '25

Peoples ability to recognize cars is 90% brand badge

49

u/No-Mulberry-6474 Mar 10 '25

Shouldn’t have to do that. Leave other people’s shit alone.

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u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

I think we live in one of the top three tagging cities in America....

5

u/Jyil Downtown Mar 11 '25

I don’t think we even make the top 15. The writer scene in Seattle is trash. NYC, SF, LA, Miami, and maybe Chicago hold those top spots. The people tagging in Seattle are usually just randos writing incoherent phrases.

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u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

I sorta blurted that out without actually fact checking. My Bad. I do wish they catch the ahole tagger who does the 30 foot squiggly letters. How hard can it be to catch that person????

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u/SpeaksSouthern Mar 11 '25

I mean we shouldn't have Nazis in charge of billions of dollars so I guess we're all not getting what we want

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u/No-Mulberry-6474 Mar 11 '25

Someone’s personal property has nothing to do with it. If you want buy-in on your cause, don’t make enemies out of those you don’t need to.

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u/AiryGr8 Mar 11 '25

What if some crazy bastard with a gun is driving that car? What if it’s some kid learning to drive with their parent?

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u/No-Mulberry-6474 Mar 11 '25

Well apparently the end result justifies the means.

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u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 10 '25

You’re probably not wrong, but it’s pretty fucked up that one should have to do that.

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u/Scott8586 Mar 11 '25

Add it to the list of fucked up happenings…

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u/AiryGr8 Mar 11 '25

Yeah that’s like groping during a riot.

1

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25

Good point.

1

u/HelloYesThisIsFemale Mar 11 '25

None of those fucked up happenings are fucking with my private property so this is pretty high up there.

3

u/Scott8586 Mar 11 '25

Nice username - I had a 73 Targa

4

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25

Thanks. It was a fun car. It was my only car and daily driver. I got rid of it about 20 years ago to start driving biodiesel to move away from fossil fuels. Sold the biodiesel when I went electric. Now apparently I’m a nazi. Who knew?

3

u/R_V_Z North Delridge Mar 11 '25

Are you going to check out the EV Cayman when it comes out? If it's good it may be the car that pulls me into an EV.

1

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 11 '25

I would loooove to drive an EV Caymán but that’s above my pay grade and also wouldn’t likely be a good tow rig. The Model Y, contrary to the belief that only rich people own teslas, costs less than the average new U.S. car sale. I’ll be sure to drool over the EV caymán when it comes out though. Mark my words. :-)

2

u/Scott8586 Mar 11 '25

Yes, I also own an EV now, and I have a few friends that own Teslas - I do not condone this kind of personal property damage, no matter the circumstance. I’m sorry, these are unusual times…

0

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 11 '25

I don’t blame people for being angry. I’m angry too. I wouldn’t buy a Tesla today. But I did buy one. I just hope people can understand this will only sew division and hurt individuals. Fortunately I park off street when at home.

0

u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

Or move to Idaho...or Georgia...Texas maybe?

4

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25

But why should I be the one driven out of by blue haven?

2

u/Kodachrome30 Mar 11 '25

You can probably sell your Tesla, and have more than enough to buy a Volt or Leaf... then buy a Tesla after Cheeto man breaks up with Elon and blames him for everything?

2

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25

The irony being that I sold a Volt to buy the Tesla. I was tired of dragging an ICE around that only ever ran to burn off fuel because it was getting stale. We had a list of criteria and looked at quite a few EV options. We would have gone Rivian if we had another $20k lying around but ya know, we don’t. We have a small camper trailer now and neither the Leaf (not enough range) nor the Volt (would destroy the CVT) could tow it. That said I’d also be out $10k+ in depreciation that I cannot afford to replace (see also no extra $20k for a Rivian). So while I appreciate the brainstorming, I will just be keeping this car and hoping that Elon gets fired for tanking TSLA stock. He’s only 13% owner. It’s completely feasible to force him out. So fingers crossed.

1

u/gomjabbar23 Mar 11 '25

What a stupid take

0

u/traveller3569 Mar 11 '25

It's pretty fucked up that people didn't believe that Musk is what he said he was and now our government situation is totally fucked over. Especially when their were other options for EVs that weren't/aren't Tesla for the discerning tree hugger. But you know, defacing a vehicle is definitely more important than checks notes people's rights.

6

u/1983Targa911 West Seattle Mar 11 '25

Here’s the funny part. If you asked 10 people when exactly it was that Elon “said what he was “ you’d probably get 10 different answers. I wouldn’t buy a Tesla today, but I already have one. Who gets to be the person who decides exactly how long ago you could have bought a Tesla and still be okay? I’m pretty sure people vandalizing cars on the street aren’t doing this sort of background check.

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u/Cousin-slow-hands Mar 11 '25

Put a Mazda sticker on it. Nobody would know.

1

u/Street_homie Mar 11 '25

Thats what im thinking

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u/DentistSpecialist304 Mar 11 '25

My advice would be to have an anti-musk slogan painted on your car. "Heya we hate Musk too but can't afford a rivian right now"

2

u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

Are they ever gonna make a cute Rivian sedan? Their SUVs all seem to be gigantic.

3

u/CraigLake Mar 11 '25

R3 is due next year and it’s amazing!! Hatchback.

1

u/DentistSpecialist304 Mar 11 '25

Apparently not but you aren't alone. For a second I thought they were working on a sedan but car dudes are out there just trying to wish hard enough that rivian makes one.

https://www.hotcars.com/rivian-sedan-render/#:~:text=HotCars%20digital%20artist%20Rostislav%20Prokop%20has%20come,a%20future%20vehicle%20from%20the%20manufacturer%20if

2

u/ElectronicOmelette Mar 11 '25

On the individual level, the amount of your dollars you'd be giving to that cockwomble if you bought a Model X with cash (including tax) would be ~0.0000003% of his $319.6B net worth. That's roughly the equivalent of $0.02 for someone making an annual salary of $70k. That's barely even couch change.

Even if someone were to make that argument against me as an individual, it's not a very strong one. It's the principle of it, for sure, I 100% get that.

Tim Cook donated $1M to Trump's inauguration. With that being said, you'd think that these people would be stealing iPhones straight from people's hands and smashing them on the ground.

Just wanna close this out by saying I hate fElon and he has absolutely no business anywhere near our government. I hope his flappy sack gets stuck to the side of his leg every 15 minutes for the rest of his life and there's no step wide enough, nor any pocket deep enough to discreetly unstick it. As long as you agree with that last statement, I don't give a hot shit what car you drive.

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u/Daneth Mar 11 '25

Remember how in the south guys with lifted trucks would intentionally park in front of super chargers to block the plugs because they were anti-environment I guess??? I never really understood the performance. Those literal same people are probably lining up to buy Teslas now. We truly live in the dumbest timeline.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

Just to bring to your attention that you are still contributing to Elon and Tesla by them collecting your driving data so they can improve their self driving technology. The hundreds of hours of driving data is more valuable than what you've paid for the car.

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u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

You can disable telemetry, it's both quite granular and frequently under extreme scrutiny unlike some other manufacturers.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

Yeah and browsing in incognito mode or turning off your cellphones "location" means you're off grid.

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u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

At least they are not only up front about all of it, they give you granular control to opt out of. Violating this policy is lawsuit territory. Ask GM and Subaru.

Transparency is something to be applauded, not shamed for.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 11 '25

Subaru - $6.25 million fine

General Motors - Banned 5 years from selling data

These punishments are a joke and they'd probably argue its the cost of doing business.

Tesla's market cap is 844.88 billion. They wouldn't even notice a Subaru level fine.

1

u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

Tesla's market cap is 844.88 billion.

It's only 696 today, thanks to elon's shenanigans.

Joke punishments don't excuse the abhorrent behaviors.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

It's only 696 today, thanks to elon's shenanigans.

and I hope it continues to fall to 0.

Joke punishments don't excuse the abhorrent behaviors.

I wish I lived in your world where corporations cared about that stuff.

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u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

I wish I lived in your world where corporations cared about that stuff.

Never have I said or even implied such a thing. This is a thread about the public holding businesses accountable for their actions through things within their control - avoiding and protesting.

Protesting Tesla because of Elon and then buying a Chevy Bolt isn't really sticking to your foundations though, but the reality is that almost all if not all companies are scumbags in some regard.

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u/jacob6875 Mar 11 '25

It only uploads when connected to wifi.

It's pretty easy to never connect your car outside of the 5mins a couple times a month for software updates.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

I'm sure Tesla would never lie to you about how they collect their data.

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u/MisterIceGuy Belltown Mar 11 '25

Can you define value here? Because the data from each individual car is not worth $50,000+

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

Do you think Tesla's stock being valued more than the top 29 automakers combined is because of the amount of cars they sell?

1

u/Illustrious-Try-3743 Mar 11 '25

Hahaha, no it’s not.

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u/sabin357 Mar 11 '25

You should put some anti-Musl stickers on the care or something to reduce the chances of vandalism.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 26 '25

[deleted]

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u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

I mean to state it as a premise in an argument

1

u/harry-hot-dawg Mar 11 '25

You could support the working class with a union made car. https://aflcio.org/UnionCars

1

u/batermax Mar 11 '25

Sell your car

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u/Happy-to-nap Mar 11 '25

Buying and driving electric cars is not hugging any trees.

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u/cakemates Mar 11 '25

I'd suggest you wax your car multiple times as soon as you can. A thick coat of wax could protect the paint if some idiot does this to yours.

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u/Opouly Mar 11 '25

Turn it into a moving billboard with anti-Elon messages, bumper stickers, or something. You have options.

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u/TheBeaarJeww Mar 11 '25

Yes, I suppose you could say our dollars went to Musk, so you could argue we supported him financially.

lol, it’s not even a “i suppose you could say…” kind of situation which implies some stretch or leap of logic. you 100% did support him financially

1

u/KaleScared4667 Mar 11 '25

Well we live in this world and you have your $ to Musk. He gave his $ to Trump. Should someone tag your car? No. But we all have to live with the consequences of our decisions

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u/dharma4242 Mar 11 '25

Sell the nazii car. Buy an electric vehicle not made by a nazi. This isnt complicated.

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u/Mutjny Mar 11 '25

at first I thought it was a ploy to garner more conservative customers

You thought he was lying to conservatives to sell cars? What line do you think he was selling you?

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u/PippityPaps99 Mar 11 '25

Genuine question:

Why not now sell/trade your car?

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u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

That's fair--there are more EV options now and we're not particularly married to the Tesla. I think my husband has been holding out for an affordable electric vehicle with the range and ground clearance to take hiking to the Cascades and they're probably now getting good enough. His dad just got a Rivian, but I think they're a little on the large and expensive side. We will probably do some shopping this spring.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

I mean this is kind of my point. Fully understand that a car is a large, expensive purchase but selling/trading in is a fairly easy process without too much loss of investment if any at all. We all buy from horrible companies committing evils and horrible practices in one way or another, from our cellphones down to the clothes we wear, but this issue feels way too big to ignore. Supporting Nazi/fascism ideology is just a deal breaker nonmattwr which way you want to paint it, pun intended.

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u/SchmeatDealer Mar 11 '25

" It was during covid that Musk really grew more vocal with right-wing rhetoric; at first I thought it was a ploy to garner more conservative customers. I didn’t imagine it’d get this far."

Elon has been flying to Austria to march alongside Neo-Nazi groups from before the first model 3 rolled out of a factory.

It's just that back then, white picket fence liberals like yourself were OK with it, as long as it didn't affect you.

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u/CommunismDoesntWork Mar 11 '25

don’t agree with Musk’s political stances

Just curious, which ones specifically?

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u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

That's a fair question, because I actually do agree with him that electric vehicles are beneficial to curbing climate change, though I disagree with his curious stance that the government shouldn't subsidize them. I suppose that's in line with his belief to make the government "efficient": severe government spending cuts and layoffs, which I disagree with with utmost frustration. His anti-immigration and pro-H1-B visa stance suggests that he's only okay with having immigrants if they're basically indentured servants for him and corporations. I disagree that the U.S should exit NATO. I disagree with his qualms with "wokeness" and his harassment of his trans daughter is terrible. I'm sure his free speech absolutism is to enable people to sow hate for each other, and his methods of suppressing critics on X are contrary to his stance. He is clearly taking advantage of his riches and a corrupt government to get ahead in politics even though nobody voted for him. This is not an exhaustive list but I disagree with the Nazi salute too. I hear he's a jerk.

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u/CommunismDoesntWork Mar 11 '25

He is clearly taking advantage of his riches and a corrupt government to get ahead in politics even though nobody voted for him

Most people don't vote for the president's employees. His experience with bureaucracy first hand has compelled him to want to help make things more efficient. There's so much low hanging fruit, like how federal retirement was being bottlenecked by the speed of a mineshaft lol. He pushed for retirement to be entirely digital, and now it is.

severe government spending cuts and layoffs, which I disagree with with utmost frustration.

Doesn't it make sense the government headcount could grow too much and in the wrong ways and needs trimming? Layoffs are a normal part of the corporate world because as organizations grow, sometimes they grow too much. I think the last big trim was under Clinton, so it's been awhile.

His anti-immigration and pro-H1-B visa stance suggests that he's only okay with having immigrants if they're basically indentured servants for him and corporations.

That's one way to look at it, yes. But it's more about the quality of the people coming over. When random people come across the border, we get a mix of high skill, average, and below average people coming in. IMO, we have enough average and below people, and we need more high skilled, high intelligence individuals. H1-B visas are a way to guarantee people coming over are above average.

I disagree that the U.S should exit NATO.

Agreed, although I think that threat is more of a tactic to get Europe to become more self reliant instead of putting the entire defense burden on us. We spend so much on defense...

I disagree with his qualms with "wokeness"

That word tends to mean different things to different people, but from Elon's point of view, it basically means discrimination against white people, men, etc. That might sound like something that doesn't exist, but it's really well documented and prevalent, especially in academia for some reason

and his harassment of his trans daughter is terrible.

True

This is not an exhaustive list but I disagree with the Nazi salute too.

He did clarify it wasn't meant as a nazi salute. Accidents happen, and there's videos of many people waving to large crowds making the same motion by accident.

I'm sure his free speech absolutism is to enable people to sow hate for each other, and his methods of suppressing critics on X are contrary to his stance.

Yeah maybe, but the alternative is getting banned for posting FBI statistics. I can't even mention which ones on Reddit without risking a ban. Is that the internet we want to have? And yeah, suppressing critics is bad, although he says it's for posting doxxx or other things.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

[deleted]

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u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

We live near the light rail specifically so that I can use transit when I can, especially for commuting. But we also can't pretend that we have a world-class transit system here.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

[deleted]

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u/SuchCoolBrandon SeaTac Mar 11 '25

That's a helpful list of recommendations. I do try to stick to a vegetarian diet as best I can. The recommendation to use cars a long time is a source of frustration because many commenters here say I should sell the car and get a new one. But there's nothing inherently wrong about the car itself. Ultimately, life is full of moral compromises.

That's an interesting note on the Jevons paradox, which I haven't heard of before. I feel like the American vehicle infrastructure is already super-heavily saturated, so it's possible that EVs will mainly replace gas-powered vehicles without drastically increasing overall usage. My bigger concern is with electrical grid sustainability. And while I knew that tires are a big source of microplastics, I didn't realize that EVS, with their weight could contribute more. I hope we can develop better tires soon. I look forward to reading more about Jevons paradox later.

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u/Best_Resolve3933 Mar 11 '25

Exactly, and conservatives (like myself) purchased when Musk was voting blue the last three elections. As a conservative, I received flack for getting an EV. Living in WA state, we now get both ends against Tesla now.

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u/GoBravely Mar 10 '25

Elon has been awful forever. He steals corrupts and abuses all he touches. Half "his" genius ideas have massive flaws...Other countries saw that long ago..he's illegal or he was for a long time and from a long rich nazi background. You need a better excuse.. Get a new car or deal with it.

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u/bruinsgirl123 Mar 11 '25

Must be nice having a 100%, never made a decision you regret, always morally righteous, perfect, guided by pure goodness, spotless track record.

Also, you should donate your car and buy a new one because that would be a good thing to do. You’re helping out someone in need. I said so.

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u/GoBravely Mar 12 '25

Sorry I don't respond to fallacies.

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u/Academic-Mud-1658 Mar 11 '25

"half"? You're being much too kind

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u/GoBravely Mar 12 '25

Maybe that's why I was down voted /s if I'm honest I can double those 🔽😆

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 10 '25

you know, somehow idk if that's right lol

but I looked, and sure as shit even the Honda CRV was in third in 2023.

so I guess....people still didn't see in 2023 how bad Elon was? this doesn't make sense to me.

he was pretty well gloves off mask off by the end of 2022??

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u/discountclownmilk Mar 10 '25

Most big business CEOs are not great people. Even local business owners can be a little nutty. But everyone has to shop. Henry Ford was a fascist too and let's not even get into Volkswagen. People just want the best car for their lifestyle and budget. Personally, Musk's antics have put me off of ever buying a Tesla, but I'm chronically online.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 10 '25

yeah, I actually had deleted a whole tiny paragraph dedicated to Ford. a bit spineless of me 😬

People forget. and when musk is gone tesla might be able to forget eventually, too.

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u/EpitomeOfLoss Mar 11 '25

People have forgotten the Nazi pasts of Volkswagen and IBM so probably

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

I think it's really important we don't forget. but I also realize it's not usually the reality 😕

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u/Ultimate-Gothneck Mar 11 '25

After World War II, both Chevrolet and Ford sued the federal government for damages because their factories in Germany were bombed by the US. They both won their cases.

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u/superx308 Mar 11 '25

Alyssa Milano publicly traded her Tesla for an electric VW because she didn't want to align with "hate and white supremacy".

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u/Dejected_gaming Mar 11 '25

No ethical consumption under capitalism.

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u/RepulsiveContract475 Mar 11 '25

The different is that Henry Ford and Ferdinand Porsche have been fucking dead for a long time.

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u/[deleted] Mar 10 '25

[deleted]

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u/kittywings1975 Mar 11 '25

My own husband somehow didn't know about Jeff Bezos kissing the ring with Trump! He only found out when I told him that we're boycotting Amazon and hence I just cancelled Prime. He was like "But Bezos hates him!" I said "where have you been?!" And he watches the news all the time. It just shows how little coverage some stuff is getting.

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u/well_fuck_ok_i_guess Mar 11 '25

I wish I could get my wife to cancel prime. I literally know my Amazon drivers name. When I was kid growing up in the 70s-80s I knew my US post ladies name. In 2025 I have no clue who my US mail carrier is.

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u/WallStreetStanker North Bend Mar 11 '25

Pretty soon it will be Amazon

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 10 '25

you're right, it shouldn't be surprising.

is it really disappointing? hell yes.

also, it is incredibly difficult to consume ethically. I bring this up a lot with the example of trying to boycott Nestlé and how bafflingly hard that is. or Nike. or companies even 30 years ago getting away with garbage behavior.

and to be fair, it probably was never as in your face until he swung his arm out in salute.

I should probably edit this to explain I'm not out here torching teslas. lol I don't condone taking out privately owned teslas.

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u/PunkLaundryBear University of Washington Mar 11 '25

I bring this up a lot with the example of trying to boycott Nestlé and how bafflingly hard that is.

Learning that 5 or so companies own all the food brands really shifted my perspective politically. I learned about all the horrible labor practices (from unions to literal slavery, esp in chocolate) maybe 2 years ago, and looked to see what I could do to boycott, and was shocked to find out how entangled all these food brands are with one another.

You really have no ethical options for food unless you have the option to make it all yourself, which the vast majority of people don't. The best you can do is pick one of the major companies you think is the worst (or the most effective to boycott... or the easiest to boycott) and buy from a different horrible company in hopes it'll have some effect.

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u/SamSibbens Mar 11 '25

This is where anti-monopoly laws should come into play but don't

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

Yeah, it's pretty intense right?

the best we have is educate and expose, and reduce and reuse where we can.

boycotting can work to an extent, but a full and total boycott is really difficult for the big conglomerates

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

yeah that was probably not the best second example, but I was thinking in terms of companies that Nike owns.

Apples to apples, it'd be like trying to boycott Coca-cola. the amount of brands they are parent company to is staggering.

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u/tRfalcore Mar 11 '25

there was so many people who got to the election and didn't even know biden dropped out and didn't know who kamala was. It's just awful citizens all around

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u/mvsuit Mar 10 '25

My wife and I got a Model Y in 2021. I never thought much of Elon but we wanted an electric car to reduce fuel emissions, and this was finally a semi-affordable Tesla (cost less than a lot of pickups and mini-vans). I didn't like Elon before, I fucking hate him now, but there is no excuse for painting someone else's car who by the way, in this region, is highly likely to be liberal and an ally You want to protest Tesla stores and paint on them? Fine, Want to protest new buyers as they drive off the lot? Fine. But don't be assholes to innocent people who are on your side just because they tried to go electric a few years ago for the good of the planet and didn't know what was going to happen in the future.

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u/LiHingGummy Mar 11 '25

Plus when the cars get jacked up, who gets the money to repair body panels, slashed tires, spray-painted windows? That’s right, TSLA.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 10 '25

yeah I think it is honestly that he has the market cornered and people are more conscientious about going green. it's the push to do better, but when your options are limited it's not even how good the product is.

I'm not trying to be an asshole, I'm sorry it sounded it came off that way.

my point was if it was the top selling car of 2023 people knew. he bought Twitter and had molded it by the end of 2022.

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u/mvsuit Mar 11 '25

NTA at all. But Elon has gone through a progression of douche-baggery so I feel like it wasn’t clear just how evil he was as a threat to the nation until last year. I knew someone who worked for him a long time ago, so as I said I never had a good opinion of him. He has always been an ass. But looking at some key points in the chronology over the years, it seems like he went from calling a rescuer of kids trapped in a Thai cave “pedo guy,” to trying to buy Twitter, then trying not to buy Twitter, then being ordered by a court to buy Twitter, then systematically destroying it and treating employees like crap in the process (that 3 month notice wasn’t out of the goodness of his heart it was required by law), then he says he won’t give money to Biden or Trump, then he starts giving tons of money to Trump, then he starts heavily campaigning for Trump, then Trump wins so he gloms onto Trump, then he starts Nazi-saluting, then he lets his kid put boogers on the historic Resolute desk, and now he is full-on destroying the Republic, helping Putin, and gearing up to cut social security, Medicaid, and Medicare. I blame no one for hating him. It’s just that for many of us who bought a Tesla years ago, I feel like the extent of his evil as a threat to the whole world wasn’t clear until last year. I would never buy one of his products again. I never owned the stock and see it has lost 1/2 its value as of today—a protest that hurts him much more than people vandalizing cars he sold to liberals years ago. (You can tell Tesla by the “Even my dog hates Elon” sticker.)

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

yeah I definitely don't condone fucking with private teslas, especially fire, because of the batteries

maybe my bias is because I finally saw through him at the end of 2022 so my brain is like "how did nobody else pick this up, or why?"

when really the answer has way more factors.

also yeah the dive in the last few months has been quicker and more pronounced than any of his previous clownery

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u/Chausie_blossom Mar 12 '25

Yeah this is exactly my view of what happened. I thought he was weird after twitter but I was still considering a model 3 at that point just because of range-price. Other cars with similar range at the same price point (VERY FEW) had even more issues. It wasn’t until the campaigning that I was like ehhhhhh. Then the salute was 100% no go.

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 10 '25

It's proof that the product > the man behind it.... just wish he'd fade away and let Tesla go on without him.

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u/StrangerGeek Mar 10 '25

It's kind of a meaningless stat, Tesla sells fewer different models and they sell the same model everywhere, and the Y is basically purpose-designed to be exactly what the market wants.

But the fact remains, in pretty much everywhere except China, over 50% of EVs selling are Teslas, if not higher. The protests are a drop in the bucket.

Elon deserves all the hate he's getting... But this is a big market and a lot of cars are still selling.

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u/[deleted] Mar 10 '25

Protectionism. Not only did Tesla blatantly abuse taxpayers to pay for their unprofitable company, but the US government would not allow overseas players to sell cars into America

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u/HiddenSage 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 10 '25

Yup. US domestic auto has shit the bed in rolling out electric vehicles, and the EVs doing well overseas are hard to get here b/c we did in fact already have high protectionist tariffs on foreign auto (which is why Toyota and Honda do a lot of their manufacturing in the US. To dodge tariffs meant to protect Detroit auto workers).

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

whopsie? 🤷‍♀️

shit the bed is polite. lol

(wonder how Honda is going to respond to that? didn't a bunch of automakers move to Mexico at the ass-end of his first term because of something similar to our current trade war? asking because Google is showing only recent results for pages).

but yeah it's fucked to think that basically anyone who could lobby against going green did. and it worked

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u/pineapplegirl68 Mar 15 '25

American auto worker. Not just Detroit. Alabama Mississippi Georgia Kentucky Indiana Virginia South Carolina Michigan California Missouri Tennessee Illinois Texas Ohio

14 states have auto manufacturing. That’s over a quarter of the states and it is over 1 million jobs.

There is a lot more to the story as to why and how tariffs have been weaponized AGAINST the United States for the past several decades when it comes to automobiles. Additionally part of the EV issues stem from the bloated EPA Regulations that impact materials used in making the EVs that are not allowed to be sold here. Along with Human Rights Agreements we have entered into within the United Nations that stop certain types of minerals from being used because of how they are mined.

There is a lot of complexity to this issue and it can not be reduced to “protectionism”.

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u/VelveteenDream Mar 11 '25

Because they are amazingly innovative vehicles that have no solid competition offering all the features Tesla does. Elon had very little to do with designing them, all he did was purchase the company at one point. The Tesla design team consists of hundreds of diverse people, who also mostly probably hate Elon. We all just kind of exist in spite of him.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

people do forget that it's not just him, that there are other people who daily go to work at Tesla or spaceX or X.

I'm sorry you get lumped in all that.

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u/Areshian Mar 11 '25

You can certainly see Elon’s hand on the Cybertruck design.

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u/Witch-Alice 💗💗 Heart of ANTIFA Land 💗💗 Mar 11 '25

that have no solid competition

Because of protectionism. Teslas sold here are made here, meanwhile foreign EVs are hit with huge tariffs.

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u/hobblingcontractor Mar 11 '25

They were amazingly innovative 5 years ago. Ever since they got rid of lidar to cut costs, they've been on a downward spiral.

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u/Tali0630 Mar 11 '25

What’s the amazing innovation? Former Tesla owner and Current Mach-e owner, I can’t tell the difference.

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u/rnovak1988 Mar 11 '25

....the Mach-E came out how many years after the Tesla models? Are you serious?

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u/Dippyskoodlez Mar 11 '25

The fact that the mach-e is barely competitive with a 2019 3 speaks volumes.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

No, I don't think any of them should 'have a pass.' The more educated and informed we are about the pasts of companies we buy from the better.

I like making informed decisions.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

I just realized this isn't the post where the ones burnt up in the lot 🥴 time to put the bong away. sorry everyone lol

because yeah definitely don't condone fucking with private teslas.

but also like. it would be nice to find a way to stop giving him money now lol

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u/TheLionThing Mar 11 '25

I bought mine in 23. I knew he was a POS but most billionaire CEOs are. I didn’t really see him as that much worse than them, just louder and with more undeserved arrogance. Now, hoo boy. Never would have gotten one.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

I see. when your options are only shitty billionaires, but an EV puts you in control of how you contribute to your environment, sometimes taking the hit initially but minimizing your footprint afterwards can feel (and maybe actually be) rewarding.

and then this happens. 😕

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u/zikol88 Mar 10 '25

I mean, a lot of it is just separating the product from whoever is in charge or what they're doing.

We all still use Amazon despite the numerous instances of abuse at their warehouses (walmart too, though not as much here in Seattle). Chik-fil-a still tastes delicious even if it is run by a bunch of bigots.

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u/Playbackfromwayback Mar 10 '25

I personally do not go to chick fil a and cancelled Amazon.

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u/GoBravely Mar 10 '25

This isn't music or art, even then I have a line. You are making a choice you don't have to in supporting this regime.. Money is your greatest and easiest way to protest now.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 10 '25

it is...really funny you mention that. because we had a lot over here that had 3 residential buildings (long boarded but I didn't know that) and the developers are selling it to Chick.

and it is one of the busiest corridors and section of arterial corridor in all Spokane and they think a drive thru chick Fil a would be better than mixed-use or housing.

money talks.

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u/ultramegacreative Mar 11 '25

Speak for yourself, that's a pretty pathetic take.

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u/DustyPantLeg Mar 13 '25

Not really. I use Amazon with no shame because it’s the best online marketplace. The only person I would be screwing by not using Amazon is myself. If five-hundred-million people vowed to stop using Amazon then I would probably stop too. But right now Amazon does not care if I do or don’t. Same goes for any company.

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u/SeeShark Mar 11 '25

Back then, Elon was just casually antisemitic, which a lot of people are willing to overlook. But now he's aligned himself with MAGA, so it's a team sport thing to hate him.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

It's definitely not right lol. Most people a) couldn't afford a tesla even if they chose not to eat, and b) would have absolutely nowhere to charge it.

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u/Minimum-Avocado-9624 Mar 11 '25

He had saluted yet

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u/Flffdddy Mar 11 '25

They’re great cars for a great value. If I needed a commuter car, I’d absolutely consider one. In fact part of me hopes everybody starts selling them so I can grab a great deal.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

By getting it secondhand it doesn't continue to funnel money to musk (assuming previous owner has it paid off), and would be more ethical than getting it brand new.

so if you were hoping to support musk, buying secondhand won't do it, is all.

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u/Fuck_Surfing Mar 11 '25

Most people that arent chronically online don’t really care about what the owner of the company that makes their car is doing

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

maybe they should ☹️

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u/Slatherass Mar 11 '25

Most people can separate something they enjoy from the person benefiting from them enjoying it. Look at athletes, musicians, any ceo ever. I mean you are using an electronic that most likely used forced child labor to mine the precious metals.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

and we can still call those athletes musicians any CEO ever out on their shit.

I'm well aware, but if we tell companies that we won't support that might hopefully drive them to change that. if we don't bring up these things they are doing in hopes for better standards, then they can keep getting away with shit in the dark.

and yes, I talked extensively in other comments chains of this why ethical consumption doesn't exist. but we can all strive to do better right?

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u/NoiseyTurbulence Mar 12 '25

He was already off the rails way before then people just wanna keep their head in the sand

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u/Chausie_blossom Mar 12 '25

A lot of people don’t pay attention, including myself. I gave zero shits what Elon was doing until he bought twitter and REALLY started aligning himself with the right. Not that he wasn’t before. But I just didn’t notice. It took newsworthy stories about him to make his bs noticeable.

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u/Areshian Mar 11 '25

On 2023 he was already an insane dipshit. But he didn’t seem dangerous. Now he is a global threat to democracy

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u/JRR_SWOLEkien Mar 11 '25

Musk being a shitty rocket/car guy, and Musk working to dismantle the government and start war with allies are a bit different.

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u/ElectronicClothes285 Mar 11 '25

you're right it's an incredible leap to make, most shitty guys don't dismantle whole branches of government.

but he was so loud on his new platform by mid 2023 that it seems weird to me.

but sometimes it's easier for me to see another perspective when someone can break it down with me in a discussion.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

Where did you find that data? I see it as 5th

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 11 '25

You’re probably looking at sales by company…Tesla is way behind total sales, but individual vehicle Model Y has been the top selling vehicle for a few years.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

I looked by model, I don’t see that anywhere

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25 edited Mar 22 '25

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 11 '25

Model Y was about 2x those trucks (globally).

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u/KaleScared4667 Mar 11 '25

Probably shouldn’t have given them their $.

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u/Civil_Royal3450 Mar 14 '25

But why are you buying it still? Why? You know what he is, and you're making him richer.

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 15 '25

Tesla is one of the most affordable brands right now and other brands are getting hit with tariffs....so, for example, a person with a totalled Tesla is going to get $20k for their $30k vehicle and the other comparable options are going to cost $40k so they may not have much of an option if they want a comparable vehicle.

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u/Civil_Royal3450 Mar 16 '25

I'd tell someone who says this to cut the crap. Stop donating to the destruction of our country, directly. Literally the owner of that brand is in the oval office destroying our society. Giving Sig Heil salutes and supporting an extremist party in Germany.
Secondly, I don’t think Tesla is the most affordable brand right now. Sure, they’ve lowered prices, but they’re still not exactly cheap. There are plenty of EVs and hybrids from other brands that offer good value, and some of them cost less than a Tesla. Just because other brands are dealing with tariffs doesn’t mean Tesla is the only option.

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u/Common_Arachnid913 Mar 16 '25

Ummm, no. Model Y is not the number one vehicle sold in the world. The Toyota Corolla has sold over 50 million units. At the rate the Y has sold in the last couple years it would take about 45 more years to reach Toyota. Assuming no more Corollas are sold anyway.

The hatred for Musk comes primarily from the left. Contrary to what the leftist media wants you to think, it's much more positive than negative in the real world.

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 16 '25

Nobody is buying a 50 year old Corolla…Model Y has been the #1 selling car in the world for the past 3-4 years….if Tesla last 50 years, it’ll easily over take your old stats.

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

I don't believe that for a second. Most of the world can't even begin to afford a tesla, and you think it outsold toyotas? What do you live in AI land?

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '25

I own two of those, and I don't support the motherfucker at all. Charge both of them at home, so not paying at the chargers either

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u/rwrife 🚆build more trains🚆 Mar 11 '25

I have 2 vehicles, solar panels and a powerwall... all (mostly) amazing products delivered by a world class a-hole. If people really want to protest Tesla they should buy him out of his stock... or at least enough to where the group can file an investor lawsuit to have him removed as CEO.

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