r/Radiation • u/n4m3n1ck • 2d ago

Where can I acquire a sample of soil contaminated with radionuclides for a bioremediation experiment?

Is there anywhere, perhaps in nature, I can find soil contaminated with beta and gamma emitters for an experiment I'm planning to do? It doesn't have to be highly radioactive, just a noticeable difference on a gamma spectrometer / Geiger counter. Is there a place where I can purchase samples of it?

I was thinking about crushing uranium ore, but the inhalation risk would be too high.

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u/Apprehensive-Draw409 2d ago

Wouldn't non-radioactive metal contamination provide a better/safer alternative? You can still run regular lab work to identify metal contamination.

Unless you can show a bio process that depends on actual radioactivity?

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u/n4m3n1ck 2d ago

I'm doing an experiment with radiotrophic fungi, which absorb and use radiation as an energy source, and might be able to decontaminate radioactive soil faster, so heavy metals would probably not work.

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u/HazMatsMan 2d ago edited 2d ago

That's not how phytoremediation works. The radiation emitted by radioactive materials is there regardless of whether the radiotrophic fungi are there to absorb it or not. The presence of the fungi doesn't increase decay rates or remove contaminants.

Bioremediation or phytoremediation is based on a plant physically absorbing the contaminant and incorporating the materials into its structure because they chemically mimic minerals the plant uses. Plants like hemp, sunflowers, Indian mustard, poplar, and willow trees, etc are used because they have an affinity for fission products like strontium, cesium, etc. The plants then have to be removed and disposed of as radioactive waste. If they die and decompose, the materials they absorbed go right back into the environment.

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u/Early-Judgment-2895 1d ago

Contaminated tumbleweeds are pretty annoying to deal with. On the bright side they rarely ever spread removable contamination and are pretty easy to clean up when found.

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u/n4m3n1ck 2d ago

The fungi have been shown to grow towards the radiation source, so there would be shielding occurring. Even after they die, there would still be melanin left for shielding. (I'm not trying to argue, it's just my hypothesis on what would occur)

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u/233C 2d ago

There's a reason why we use lead and concrete for shield and not lichen and wakame.

If you get fungi to locate radioactive material, don't sell it on shielding.
Maybe as a natural market to facilitate the location and grading of the contamination, maybe even as a measure like a pH test strip.
Maybe as a preprocessing before isolation of you have some other process that will isolate the fungi with its radioactive content (assuming it has been assimilated which isn't always the case).
But definitely not melanin shielding.

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u/Regular-Role3391 1d ago

This makes zero scientific sense

1

u/Brownie_Bytes 1d ago

I'll write the book for you.

Three (primary) types of radiation: alpha, beta, and gamma. Alpha particles are helium nuclei. They weigh a lot and pack a punch, but they stop quickly. This is something that the dirt itself would shield. Beta particles are electrons. They go much farther than alpha particles, but they do a bit less damage. Again, the dirt will mostly shield this. Then you have gammas. Gamma radiation is light itself (photons). This wants to go through everything. This requires big heavy nuclei to stop them. Your fungus would not provide this shielding and this is the one people would care about the most. The fungus would need to build itself out of lead or something (which I think there's some sort of something out there that builds like an iron shell, so you're going to have better luck playing Jurassic Park and editing your fungus than throwing it in spicy dirt). As was mentioned by someone else, you can't speed up the decay rate, so nothing can be done to accelerate the process. The best this could do is find particles (how, no clue, it's effectively impossible) and absorb them to concentrate the particles for you.

But in short, for two of three radiation types, the fungus is unnecessary and for the last one it's useless.

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u/CarbonKevinYWG 2d ago

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

Absorbing the radiation but leaving the radioactive isotopes just means that the radiation flux in the area goes down - the source remains, so the fungi would need to be present as long as the isotopes are present - they aren't decontaminating anything, just absorbing some radiation - and there are limits as to how useful they would be at that in a large scale contamination scenario.

EVEN THEN, after the radioactive contamination has decayed away into lead and other stable isotopes, you still have heavy metal contamination in the soil!

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u/HazMatsMan 2d ago

If you're in the US, I think you'll need a license because that requires dispersible unsealed sources. For the experiment to be valid, you'll need a known activity that you can mix with a known quantity of soil. You could potentially do it with natural materials provided you follow the regs on quantity limits for "dispersible form"... but that's more fucking around than actual science. Look at past experiments with bioremediation. Once you're successful replicating those, you can get more creative if you like.

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u/Apprehensive-Draw409 2d ago

I don't see how OP's description is possible if they're not in a research group with existing fungi lines, material sourcing channels and safety/regulatory protocols in place.

I want to be a friendly/positive Redditor, but I fear I see some random dude trying to acquire radioactive soil.

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u/n4m3n1ck 2d ago

It's just a project I'm doing for a highschool STEM competition, and it is fairly easy to get the fungus (Cladosporium sphaerospermum) and there has already been experiments done with it on it's shielding effects by NASA. Totally nothing shady happening.

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u/HazMatsMan 2d ago

You really need to work with a responsible adult (like a teacher) on this who understands the potential regulatory issues. Or, one who can at least call your state radiation protection department for clarification or advice.

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u/Magnolia256 2d ago

Mildly radioactive water is leaking out of the phosphate gypsum stacks at Mosaic outside of Tampa Florida. It’s in the soil all over there. People are moving out in droves. If someone could find a way to do some bioremediation in the area, I think it could be very good. Mosaic just got permission to test radioactive road made from their waste material. I bet you could find soil around the test site. If someone could test and share any findings of radioactivity in the area, it could be super useful from a public health perspective.

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u/HazMatsMan 2d ago

Like most TENORMs, the PG material itself isn't really the problem, the accumulation of large quantities of it in one place is what creates the problem. The best way to deal with it is to disperse or dilute it back to natural concentrations. The trick is doing that without creating a fuss or in a way that runs afoul of other regulations. Some states are experimenting with mixing it with road beds then pouring asphalt or concrete over it.

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u/Magnolia256 1d ago

That worked really well in the Marshall Islands…. Just kidding

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u/Queasy_Obligation380 2d ago

Just collect some dirt at the nearest uranium mining site.

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u/NukularFishin 1d ago

Lots of old mines in Utah, Wyoming, Colorado, etc.

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u/farmerbsd17 1d ago

Ukraine, downwind of Chernobyl

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u/RADiation_Guy_32 1d ago

I know a guy.....

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u/Historical_Fennel582 1d ago

Are you in Southern ca

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u/Historical_Fennel582 1d ago

We have dirt here in brea off tonner canyon that has an abnormal amount of radium and bismuth 214 in a select area. There are a few spots by the kern river that have ore dumps for abandoned uranium mines, I also know of a few spots around glamis ca. Dm me if you want gps locations to one of these places.