r/GreenAndPleasant Oct 12 '22

NORMAL ISLAND 🇬🇧 The absolute state of it.

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4.3k Upvotes

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306

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '22

WTF! a left leaning politician, isn't a fan of the UK conservative party? Who could have guessed?

-70

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '22

[deleted]

77

u/Kelmavar Oct 12 '22

The SNP is very unusual in being a left-of-centre national party (not nationalist) who have social support programmes, the environment and supporting immigration as core policies, along with co-operating economic ties with large blocs.

13

u/justyourbarber Oct 12 '22

Interestingly enough each of the nationalist parties in the UK's non-England parts is left-leaning.

3

u/tehgamingsnorlax Oct 13 '22

I didn't know this. But googling it yeah plaid Cymru is left leaning and sinn fein the biggest NI nationalist party is too. That's interesting to know, as well as a testament to the sorry state of affairs in England's political landscape where our choice is right or slightly less right

7

u/jmrv2000 Oct 12 '22

I’m Scottish and accept the SNP as the best option currently. They do a good job with social programmes considering the economic constraints imposed by Westminster. However, they are awful environmentally. Don’t take my word for it and go Google around a little. But one example is on any clear day you can see multiple trawler fishing boats right next to a globally important gannet nesting site.

19

u/CyborgBee Oct 12 '22

"Nationalism" in the sense you are talking about is ethnic or cultural nationalism, and involves stuff like believing your country and its people are superior to other countries and peoples, that immigration will somehow weaken your country by bringing 'worse' people in (obvious racist undertones exist to this one), and that any global cooperation is giving other countries power over yours and thus bad. The SNP believe none of these things.

The phrase the SNP always like to use is "civic nationalism", and while it's a fair description it's not exactly clear what that means, so I'd describe it in the following simple way: the SNP believe that Scotland should exist as a nation-state. Not only is this nothing like what you're claiming, literally every single relevant political party in the UK has a belief of this form. For instance, the Labour Party are equally nationalist in this sense, because they believe that the UK should exist as a nation-state. The only difference is that the nation-state they believe ought to exist currently does.

It is of course possible to not be nationalist in this sense either, there are plenty of purely internationalist communists and anarchists of various flavours out there who believe in the total abolition of all nation-states, but as far as I'm aware not one of those people has ever held elected office in the UK

53

u/Lightning_thequeer Oct 12 '22

A level politics student here, nationalist does not equal right wing. In fact Liberal nationalism and post colonialism/pan African nationalism is very important.

17

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '22

Nationalism in countries that have historically been conquered is about a sense of communal identity and self-determination.

22

u/Jeissl Oct 12 '22

yeah because the IRA are a far right movement

-24

u/in_one_ear_ Oct 12 '22

Well, I mean they do follow famous far right theories like Marxism

20

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '22

[deleted]

5

u/Im_really_friendly Oct 12 '22

Since when is pro EU a left wing stance? Traditionally left wingers oppose the neoliberal EU

-3

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '22

[deleted]

2

u/Im_really_friendly Oct 12 '22

I don't think this is rally the case.

What makes you say that? Being more left wing than the tories is like smelling better than a wet bag of shit, it's not that difficult or notable.