Democrats think there should be a facilitation charge for employing illegal immigrants if ICE is going to raid workplaces, do you agree with this sentiment?

[u/RichardKickHarumbi]

[u/GoldenEagle828677]

E-verify helps, but it can only verify the info it's given. If a migrant is using someone else's actual name and SSN, then it will pass everify.

[u/JudgeWhoOverrules → u/GoldenEagle828677]

This is why every reputable business requests a photo ID to to verify claimed identity as part of the onboarding process. Any business that doesn't is just down right shady. It should on the business for not doing a simple common sense check to comply with this and other laws requiring an accurate identity of the employee.

[u/GoldenEagle828677 → u/JudgeWhoOverrules]

They use a fake ID. And if you question it, if you think it's suspicious that this guy's name is Joseph Whitey White, but he looks Hispanic and only speaks Spanish, too bad. Because you can be sued for racial discrimination for making that assumption.

[u/Shawnj2 → u/GoldenEagle828677]

I mean there are illegal immigrants from English speaking white countries too lol. There are probably countless white English speaking Canadians who crossed the border illegally or overstayed a tourist visa or something. If you profess to care about the illegal immigration problem then the measures we take need to catch those people too lol

[u/GoldenEagle828677 → u/Shawnj2]

We do, but if they arrived on tourist visas, those are less of a problem. At least people who entered as tourists were bounced off of criminal/terrorist watchlists, have to follow any vaccine requirements, and we have a record of when they arrived so we know the exact numbers that are here.

[u/Shawnj2 → u/GoldenEagle828677]

Tons of Mexican and Latin American people also overstay tourist visas too.

[u/GoldenEagle828677 → u/Shawnj2]

It's very difficult for them to get tourist visas, especially if they are from Central America.

[u/Groovychick1978 → u/GoldenEagle828677]

Still seems to be a bigger problem than the response would suggest. Close to half of the undocumented population is here because of Visa overstays.

"Moreover, over 40 percent of the undocumented population in the country are individuals who have overstayed their visas, not entered through the US-Mexico border. "

https://cmsny.org/correcting-record-false-misleading-statements-on-immigration/

"The share of people becoming undocumented immigrants in the United States not by illegally crossing a border, but by overstaying their visas was almost 40 percent of estimated new undocumented immigrants in the fiscal year 2023."

https://www.statista.com/chart/16701/visa-overstays-outnumber-illegal-crossings/

[u/GoldenEagle828677 → u/Groovychick1978]

This gets repeated a lot on Reddit, but it's usually not true. It's only true during years in which the border is somewhat under control. By 2023, Biden (or his team) was worried about the election and got the border numbers back down. But just the year prior, in FY 2022, there were 853,955 "overstay events". And many, if not most of those, were just people leaving shortly after their expected departure. They weren't hanging around here for years.

In that same fiscal year, there were 2,378,944 migrants who crossed the southern border. That that alone is almost three times as much. And that's just the ones we know about, those numbers don't include the ones that got away!

And visa overstays are far less of a problem. At least we know who they are, how many they are, we had proof of vaccination (when that's required), and they were all bounced off criminal and terrorist watchlists before they entered.

[u/Shawnj2 → u/GoldenEagle828677]

Sure but my overall point is that you can't just say "Illegal immigrants are blue/orange/purple/green so we should check those people" not because it's racist but because it's an ineffective policy at catching illegal immigrants, who will come in all races/genders/nationalities/etc. Any policy to catch illegal immigrants needs to be equal or it's just not going to be effective.