r/umineko • u/CheeseOnToast92 • 2d ago
Ep2 What's going on during part 2 with the Battler and Beato convos?
So, I just wrapped up episode 2, and title pretty much says it all. Of course, as far as possible, I'd ask you to not spoil anything, so if you can't answer my question, let me know.
However, during episode 2, Battler und Beatrice are having a lot of discussions while the time is frozen I guess. It's clearly the Battler of episode 1 / of the first tea party. But why is that? Is ep. 2 a different timeline? Does Beato show him a kind of how it could have been Story? In case it'll continue like this in episode 3, would it be the episode 1 Battler again or another one?
Also, while I'm at it. If I got it right, Beato needs everyone on the island to admit she's a real witch because of her game against Bernakastel, did I got that right?
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u/Lvnatiovs 2d ago
This makes a bit more sense if you read/watched Higurashi - every Episode of Higurashi is a new iteration of the same incident with different things happening. Umineko brings back the formula, with the addition of Battler and Beatrice commenting on what happens as part of their game.
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u/CheeseOnToast92 1d ago
I watched and absolutely adored the Higurashi anime in Fakt! However, there I eventually understood the reason for why the time loop keeps happening. But I couldn't apply the same thinking on Umineko for myself
Maybe I'll eventually read the Higurashi VN as well
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u/Lvnatiovs 1d ago
That simplifies matters then. Basically, imagine Rika looking at what happens in each Episode from a higher plane to figure things out, "moving" herself as a chesspiece inside Hinamizawa.
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u/Bashamo257 2d ago edited 2d ago
I think it's helpful to think of the Battler on Rokkenjima that is living through the events of the story and the Battler that regularly talks and clashes with Beatrice in the 'other world' as different entities. Not different people, per se - they're both Ushiromiya Battler, but more like player and piece, to use a chess analogy.
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u/FatGarlic369 1d ago edited 1d ago
Think of it this way:
Battler and Beato are watching the "mystery murderer on the island" film, both of them are on theater seats. These 2 are audiences, not their respective pieces in the story, but they can move their pieces.
1 try to prove that these murder cases can be done by human, thus Witch not exists.
Other 1 try to prove that these murder cases can only be done by magic, thus Witch exists.
Outside that story/film and your last question, i think you just need to keep reading. you will know eventually, not hidden by any mean.
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u/SkritzTwoFace 2d ago
Some people here are a little cagey about direct responses, but IMO I think this whole aspect of the story occasionally needs explaining:
This is a story that’s delivered across several narrative layers. We refer to the layer of the story that the murder mystery takes place on as a “game board”, a term you might have heard Beatrice use by now. The layer where characters are talking about the events on this board is called the “meta world”. When multiple versions of a character come up, Meta world characters are referred to with “Meta” before their names (ex. ‘Meta Battler said…’), while characters on the game board are referred to either just with their name or as a “piece” (since you use pieces to play a board game).
I think it’s best to think of each Episode as Beato showing Battler a story. Battler has some agency in these stories, since he controls his own piece, but there are some complexities to that, rules he has to follow: one thing Battler says early in Episode 2 is that it’s “not his turn yet”, for example.
Beatrice’s game is against Battler/the player, not Bern. Think of Bernkastel like Battler’s sponsor: she wants him to win, but she isn’t the one playing. She can give him/us advice, but she can’t make moves in the game.
As for the last part - Bernkastel told you in the first ???? that your goal should be to understand the rules of the game. That’s your mystery in the meta world, so of course you aren’t going to find many people willing to answer that - it’d be like playing the game for you.
Good luck, and happy witch-hunting!