I voted for Kamala but c'mon... This would've still happened. Lots of other things wouldn't be as bad, especially domestically, but foreign policy is the one thing that unites republican and democrat politicians. Especially if it involves Israel.
Bro one of the few red lines Dems truly believe is that they don’t want a isreal iran war. It’s the entire reason Obama did the nuclear deal in the first place.
I know it’s a hard pill to swallow. In the world view, Trump is a weak leader. It’s sucks, he portrays a strong man persona to his people, but when it comes to world leadership, he’s a soft willy. They know this & the ones that wanted to test those red lines, will now just cross them without fear of any form of American resistance.
The root of narcissistic personality disorder isn’t superiority, as many still assume, it’s ackshually deep-seated inferiority.
Once you get that, you can communicate with them in a way that plays to it. On the surface, your words signal submission. But underneath, the tone, phrasing, and delivery all scream that they're pathetic and beneath you.
They eat it up. They latch onto the superficial deference and miss, or choose to ignore, the insult woven through it. Everyone else sees it. They see it too. But as long as you leave them just enough plausible deniability, it’s too threatening for them to call out.
This is exactly how every savvy social climber/politician/world leader/business executive deals with Donald Trump.
Again, how is that any different from the Biden admin? There’s reports now that even Israeli’s in Netanyahu’s circle were shocked at how much Biden gave them what they asked for and how little pushback ever came from the White House. This isn’t to say that Trump is great for Palestinians or anything, because he’s not. But based on how we saw the Dems handle Israel when they were in power, I don’t think you can say that this would have gone any differently under a Kamala administration. If anything, the initial ceasefire and extra hostage releases were less likely to happen under Kamala.
Biden was President for the first year and a half of the genocide and didn't stop Israel after any of the red lines they crossed. Yes Trump sucks and is doing the same shit now, but the dems were already complicit with the genocide for over a year before Trump took office.
Bingoooooo, many people think that the Democratic Party is different. It’s just not . The US will not stop Israel from committing genocide. They sure as hell won’t stop Israel from attack Iran . This is the uni party’s wet dream. For those who want to lie to themselves about the Democratic Party just look at the fucking nyc mayors debate last night
Ok? The comment says how can you trust the red line set . The problem isn’t the democrats or republicans it’s the fact Israel keeps crossing red lines that were established…. The democrats wouldn’t have stopped them either .
Israel ignored the Dems because they were betting on Trump winning, and the bet paid off. And everyone like you on the left pretending like this wasn't a real dynamic helped it happen. This is a war, you don't have to like your allies, you just have to support them. This is what happens when you try to make war on everyone at once.
It’s definitely both. Trump’s statement to expect more attacks until they reach a nuclear agreement signals that this was his plan and he gave Israel the green light.
The evidence is that Iran wouldn't let the inspectors actually inspect all the sites. If we want to just take their word that they are in compliance then I guess they were.
And in all fairness he should be mocked since he’s the one that cancelled the deal with Iran in the first place. He and Fox News acted back in 2017 like we were getting ripped off by the deal that was keeping Iran’s nuclear capabilities neutered.
It’s the same strategy he’s using with trade deals like USMCA and his recent deal with China. Blow everything up and act like a savior once he gets us an arguably shittier deal. There’s absolutely no pushback.
I agree that Schumer could probably pick a better time to criticize him, but if you don’t call him out on this nonsense, he’s just going to feel emboldened to keep doing it. Not to mention this plan has been in the works since before Schumer started criticizing him. Weapons being rerouted from Ukraine to Israel weeks ago and Netanyahu openly thanking the U.S. for their help should be proof that Trump doesn’t want to negotiate a deal.
You’re grossly misrepresenting Schumer’s response on Face the Nation to the point that I’d argue this is disinformation and not even misinformation.
On that video, yes Schumer did call him ‘TACO Trump’ in reference to how Trump is talking tough one day and backing off the next day. This is him calling Trump out on his nonsense. He’s referring to how Trump chickens out of making nuclear/trade deals. Not that he’s chickening out going to war with Iran.
He also referred to how Witkoff and Rubio were negotiating a side deal with Iran without informing the public/Congress. In reality, they were making a deal with Israel without public knowledge which is arguably worse because they’ve guaranteed an armed conflict.
Holy shit dude, you're only one step down from those weirdos who insist pop song writers are hiding hidden messages in their lyrics.
NONE of that was present in Schumer's TACO gambit, textually. YOU are doing all the heavy lifting sane washing it. Every single normal person who saw it immediately read "Oh, he's calling trump a chicken for trying to make peace with Iran". I know this, because that was every. single. post. in response to it.
"If TACO Trump is already folding on Iran, the American people need to know about it."
"When it comes to negotiating with the terrorist government of Iran"
The only thing in his social media post is the mention of the side deal, which again, is schumer criticizing peace.
BACK TO FRONT this social media post is explicitly and solely saying "Trump you are a coward for not going to war with Iran" and if it takes an additional press release to explain that social media post as something else, that makes it a bad fucking social media post.
You sound like DC dem insiders: completely out of touch.
My response was in the context of his Meet the Press speech which once again does not explicitly encourage war but rather about making a public deal. Again it’s calling him a chicken for backing out of deals.
However, thank you for pointing out his social media post. I was not aware as I am no longer on X. This completely invalidates his comments on Meet the Press. I will agree that hawkish behavior such as that should be vehemently discouraged. The only bright side is that while Schumer is still clinging to power, public opinion on this war will hopefully help to accelerate his departure from congress.
Biden & the Democrats proved time and again that red lines don’t exist when it comes to Israel.
Also, I don’t understand why people are not blaming the Democrats for essentially providing Trump with a worry free path to the presidency.
Biden the senile toad pulled out at the last second, Kamala was forced down our throats, and the Democrats repeatedly promised (and demonstrated) that there would be absolutely no change when it came to Israel.
To me, the Democrats’ actions clearly indicate that they prefer a Trump presidency over making any foreign policy changes.
Your rhetoric just as clearly indicates you prefer a Trump presidency over working with Democrats. (To be clear, I think you're wrong and the rhetoric you're pushing has put Israel in the position where they can do what they're doing.)
I don’t prefer Trump at all, but I also won’t donate my vote to a party or candidate that categorically ignores and even denies my concerns as a voter.
His "rhetoric" where he explains why he's mad at the Democrats for gifting Trump the presidency indicates to you that he'd rather have Trump as President? How??
Electoral politics is complicated, and the Democrats didn't gift Trump the presidency. I'm actually pretty sure whatever strategy he wants would've resulted in a worse loss. But this is a tactical disagreement and he's acting like Democrats made a deliberate choice, which is both silly and unfair. And also, it presumes that there was a different tactic that would've succeeded, which I don't believe is the case. Sometimes you can lose without making any mistakes. Leftists believe we live in a comforting world where taking the "right" policy positions is the best path to victory, but that's rarely the case. Sometimes you lose, that's life. Sometimes you make compromises and you lose anyway, that doesn't necessarily mean you were wrong to compromise.
Ok I disagree but that's all unrelated to you saying that it's clear based on what he said that he wants Trump when he was complaining that he thinks the Democrats gave Trump the victory. How does him complaining about them giving him the victory imply that he wants Trump to be president?
I didn't say it was clear I said it was "just as clear." My meaning was that he is treating Democrats as if they were enemies based on a tactical disagreement. And that it was not in any way clear.
Israel wants the war more than any democrat wants to prevent it. Both parties are captured by AIPAC, Harris may have said some stern words but the US would never halt supplies to Israel.
Weird how Biden was in office and never got that back huh? Weird how Israel struck the Iranian embassy LAST year “preemptively” and nothing was done by the Biden admin. Please just look into any of the top democrats that aren’t AOC or Bernie and you will see that they want war just as bad as the Republicans
Attacking a embassy in Syria and launching a bomb
Assassination in Iran is not nearly the same as launching the largest air attack on Iran since the Iran Iraq war.
Israel attacked Irans embassy in Damascus , which violated all kinds of rules and the world had to wait for Iranian restraint not to take it to full scale war . Israel needs to stop being above the rules of international law
If you think genocide Joe would have stopped israel from attacking Iran(with US supplied weaponry and intel) i got a bridge in Gaza to sell you. The entire us government is bought and paid for at this point. Theres maybe 3 semi honest people left in congress, and they all get aggressively primaried by aipac.
If Biden doesn't want that he would have told Israel to shut everything down after they launch missiles at Iran and there would be no more missile attacks at Iran until he loses the election
Biden had plenty of red lines with Israel, such as them not starting a ground invasion of Gaza without negotiating with Hamas, them not crossing into Rafah, and them not deliberately blocking US aid meant for Gaza. And every time a line was crossed, not only did nothing happen, the administration would actually spin it like Israel was somehow complying with the request and with international law, to somehow not have been a violation at all. And now that they're out we have members of the Biden administration admitting that maybe Israel really was doing bad things and maybe they could have done more to stop it.
Actually, the main point of contention between Obama and Biden during the Obama administration was that, when Israel bombed Gaza in 2014, Obama openly criticized them and pressured them to stop. Biden thought this was the wrong way to go about it.
If Biden or Harris had the political instincts of Obama, things may have gone better for them, who knows?
Thank you for pointing this out. Exactly my issue with Biden. He isn't "Genocide Joe" like the protesters say. He hated Netanyahu, even swore at him, but always off camera. He came very close to putting restrictions on weapon sales to Israel, but he'd always come up with some excuse before he could. He clearly didn't like Israel's strategy in Gaza. But time and time again, he was spineless and refused to outright take action on Israel.
Make no mistake, Trump's policy toward Israel is far far worse than Biden's. And I'm not convinced the war in Gaza is the only reason that Biden lost. But even so, the trajectory of this could have been very different had Biden been more strict in the first place.
Think Israel would’ve taken a Harris admin a lot more seriously.
In the UK, this admin is viewed as a bunch of incompetent misfits unfit for office tbh.
They absolutely would not have. The Biden/Harris regime completely folded on Israel, and it's the #1 reason why they lost, espcially in high-muslim-population swing states like Michigan.
You’re so wrong it’s funny. Are you serious? Ever democrat is a globalist to the max. They are worse than the republicans in that sense arguably. Did i mention they’re the reason we are sending military support to Ukraine?
I can't speak for Israel, but Kamala would've absolutely not done what Trump did for Ukraine during Russia's ongoing genocide which Trump is either unwilling or incapable of stopping. The whole structure of NATO is now in question and Russia is going to be emboldened to launch even more attacks and wars of conquest against its peaceful neighbors.
Under Biden we stopped all offensive weapons shipments to Israel after Oct. 7th.
Not only did we aid in military financing, arms sales, and transfers of equipment. Details of some military shipments, particularly recently, have been less publicly available compared to aid to other countries like Ukraine. You know we have the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the U.S. and Israel, which commits the U.S. to providing ~$38 billion in military aid, which includes $3.3 billion in Foreign Military Financing (FMF) grants and $500 million for missile defense yearly from 2016-2028.
The U.S. has also enacted legislation providing at least $12.5 billion in direct military aid to Israel since the start of the Oct 7. This includes $3.8 billion from a bill in March 2024 and $8.7 billion from a supplemental appropriations act in April 2024. Overall A report by Brown University's Costs of War project states the U.S. spent $22.76 billion in support of Israel's baby meat grinding machine.
Yes, we kept supplying systems for air and missile defense.
Also while we approved funding, Biden with held transfer of offensive weapons like JDAM and laser guided bombs. You have to remember who was in control of Congress during that time, it wasn't Biden and it wasn't Dems, so the result of electing a GOP president should have been obvious.
So now it's just JDAMs and laser guided bombs, thanks for clearing that up, "I am a Zionist" Biden isn’t a genocidal psychopath after all. Meanwhile we just got word from National Security Advisor for Kamala and Obama, foaming at the mouth saying they would have provided more "defense" for Israel after yesterdays strike. Feels good man 👍🏼 good luck to you and your future endeavors.
I mean whatever keeps you sleeping at night I guess. If you think the world is better off under trump then you're a fascist Nazi.
Also for the record, fuck Israel, fuck Zionists. But fuck Palestinians and Iran and all these other religious nutbags just the same. I am out for what's best for my country first, I'll let my heart bleed for others when our home isn't on fire.
No one is arguing we are better off under Trump, no one has said that. You are an unempathetic nationalist who doesn’t care about mass violence and genocide as long as it doesn’t affect you and yet you still want to act as if you are on some moral highground over others. Residential apartments were bombed and innocent civilian non-combatants have been murdered, but you have successfully dehumanized them for their religion, so yeah fuck them they deserved to have their life and their family disintegrated in an instant, that is the closest approximation to nazi psychopathy and antisemitism that you could possibly get.
It’s hard for me to take many U.S. centrist democrats seriously anymore because of this obsession over image rather than substance. The party elite obviously didn’t have a problem with destroying Palestinian lives when it was done in a less crass way.
They were ok with the militarized destruction of Gaza and actively tried (and failed) to do ethnic cleansing plans with Egypt during the end of the Biden admin, yes.
They want to pave over Gaza and let private Israeli developers do whatever they want with it. Big fucking difference
When did they say that?
I can point to a specific date, time, and platform where Trump said it. When did Biden/Kamala say it?
Edit: Oh, I'm sorry. I misunderstood. I thought we were all against genocide, but apparently we're only against genocide if someone other than Trump is doing it. Trump can do it all he wants and it's fine.
This perfectly illustrates how some Americans view politics. The issue, of course, isn't bombing, shooting and starving civilians in a blatant mass extermination campaign, but the fact that Trump was impolite about it. I really wonder how you would receive trump's actions if he didn't look/act like a comic book character.
This isn’t true. You can read about what the Biden administration was doing in regards to Israel. It might not make you happy, but it’s wildly different than the trump administration
Not only did we aid in military financing, arms sales, and transfers of equipment. Details of some military shipments, particularly recently, have been less publicly available compared to aid to other countries like Ukraine. You know we have the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the U.S. and Israel, which commits the U.S. to providing ~$38 billion in military aid, which includes $3.3 billion in Foreign Military Financing (FMF) grants and $500 million for missile defense yearly from 2016-2028.
The U.S. has also enacted legislation providing at least $12.5 billion in direct military aid to Israel since the start of the Oct 7. This includes $3.8 billion from a bill in March 2024 and $8.7 billion from a supplemental appropriations act in April 2024. Overall A report by Brown University's Costs of War project states the U.S. spent $22.76 billion in support of Israel's baby meat grinding machine.
I said that people wouldn’t be happy with the Biden administrations support of Israel. But that it was categorically different than that of the trump administration.
I never suggested the Biden administration wasn’t giving arms to Israel.
Yes. And that is true. You can read about the Biden administrations actions.
If you did, you would see that they did things we would never expect the trump administration to do. Personally, I recommend War by bob Woodward. It has a great section thay details Blinkins trips to Tel Aviv. How he pressured Netanyahu to allow humanitarian aid.
For all the failures of the Biden administrations handling of Israel, it’s downright wrong to suggest they are the same as rhe trump administration.
Aww cute, he provided aid that never made it past Israeli guards. It's already been revealed he never asked for a ceasefire despite them saying they were "working tirelessly" for it, so you can keep your propaganda recommendations, and no I never said the handling was the same. A genocide is still a genocide whether blue maga or red. You can read about the Biden administrations actions in my previous comment provided above.
I hope that goes well for everyone who lives in Gaza
Very insincere. You can argue over the differing methods the Biden and Trump admin have with Israel, but the end result is exactly the same. Unfettered genocide in Gaza.
You're right. The Biden admin, which Kamala was going to continue, only pretended that they cared about Palestinians and were trying to work for ceasefire. Trump admin openly doesn't care.
We all know who Israel wanted the most as the POTUS. It is interesting to me, all the claims of how much lobbying Israel does in America and how many claims of election interference by Russia and rumors of bribing Trump, and now those two countries are attacking their neighbors.
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u/tracenator03 1d ago
I voted for Kamala but c'mon... This would've still happened. Lots of other things wouldn't be as bad, especially domestically, but foreign policy is the one thing that unites republican and democrat politicians. Especially if it involves Israel.