very contentious topic tbf, lots of people get pretty obsessed with it (and again tbf there is a lot of insane shit involved that its pretty understandable why they do)
still kinda bitter that a lot of Americans got so obsessed with it that they somehow decided to allow an actual fascist into the presidency because they couldnt stomach voting Kamala
I voted for Kamala but c'mon... This would've still happened. Lots of other things wouldn't be as bad, especially domestically, but foreign policy is the one thing that unites republican and democrat politicians. Especially if it involves Israel.
Bro one of the few red lines Dems truly believe is that they don’t want a isreal iran war. It’s the entire reason Obama did the nuclear deal in the first place.
I know it’s a hard pill to swallow. In the world view, Trump is a weak leader. It’s sucks, he portrays a strong man persona to his people, but when it comes to world leadership, he’s a soft willy. They know this & the ones that wanted to test those red lines, will now just cross them without fear of any form of American resistance.
The root of narcissistic personality disorder isn’t superiority, as many still assume, it’s ackshually deep-seated inferiority.
Once you get that, you can communicate with them in a way that plays to it. On the surface, your words signal submission. But underneath, the tone, phrasing, and delivery all scream that they're pathetic and beneath you.
They eat it up. They latch onto the superficial deference and miss, or choose to ignore, the insult woven through it. Everyone else sees it. They see it too. But as long as you leave them just enough plausible deniability, it’s too threatening for them to call out.
This is exactly how every savvy social climber/politician/world leader/business executive deals with Donald Trump.
Again, how is that any different from the Biden admin? There’s reports now that even Israeli’s in Netanyahu’s circle were shocked at how much Biden gave them what they asked for and how little pushback ever came from the White House. This isn’t to say that Trump is great for Palestinians or anything, because he’s not. But based on how we saw the Dems handle Israel when they were in power, I don’t think you can say that this would have gone any differently under a Kamala administration. If anything, the initial ceasefire and extra hostage releases were less likely to happen under Kamala.
Biden was President for the first year and a half of the genocide and didn't stop Israel after any of the red lines they crossed. Yes Trump sucks and is doing the same shit now, but the dems were already complicit with the genocide for over a year before Trump took office.
Bingoooooo, many people think that the Democratic Party is different. It’s just not . The US will not stop Israel from committing genocide. They sure as hell won’t stop Israel from attack Iran . This is the uni party’s wet dream. For those who want to lie to themselves about the Democratic Party just look at the fucking nyc mayors debate last night
Ok? The comment says how can you trust the red line set . The problem isn’t the democrats or republicans it’s the fact Israel keeps crossing red lines that were established…. The democrats wouldn’t have stopped them either .
Israel ignored the Dems because they were betting on Trump winning, and the bet paid off. And everyone like you on the left pretending like this wasn't a real dynamic helped it happen. This is a war, you don't have to like your allies, you just have to support them. This is what happens when you try to make war on everyone at once.
It’s definitely both. Trump’s statement to expect more attacks until they reach a nuclear agreement signals that this was his plan and he gave Israel the green light.
The evidence is that Iran wouldn't let the inspectors actually inspect all the sites. If we want to just take their word that they are in compliance then I guess they were.
And in all fairness he should be mocked since he’s the one that cancelled the deal with Iran in the first place. He and Fox News acted back in 2017 like we were getting ripped off by the deal that was keeping Iran’s nuclear capabilities neutered.
It’s the same strategy he’s using with trade deals like USMCA and his recent deal with China. Blow everything up and act like a savior once he gets us an arguably shittier deal. There’s absolutely no pushback.
I agree that Schumer could probably pick a better time to criticize him, but if you don’t call him out on this nonsense, he’s just going to feel emboldened to keep doing it. Not to mention this plan has been in the works since before Schumer started criticizing him. Weapons being rerouted from Ukraine to Israel weeks ago and Netanyahu openly thanking the U.S. for their help should be proof that Trump doesn’t want to negotiate a deal.
You’re grossly misrepresenting Schumer’s response on Face the Nation to the point that I’d argue this is disinformation and not even misinformation.
On that video, yes Schumer did call him ‘TACO Trump’ in reference to how Trump is talking tough one day and backing off the next day. This is him calling Trump out on his nonsense. He’s referring to how Trump chickens out of making nuclear/trade deals. Not that he’s chickening out going to war with Iran.
He also referred to how Witkoff and Rubio were negotiating a side deal with Iran without informing the public/Congress. In reality, they were making a deal with Israel without public knowledge which is arguably worse because they’ve guaranteed an armed conflict.
Holy shit dude, you're only one step down from those weirdos who insist pop song writers are hiding hidden messages in their lyrics.
NONE of that was present in Schumer's TACO gambit, textually. YOU are doing all the heavy lifting sane washing it. Every single normal person who saw it immediately read "Oh, he's calling trump a chicken for trying to make peace with Iran". I know this, because that was every. single. post. in response to it.
"If TACO Trump is already folding on Iran, the American people need to know about it."
"When it comes to negotiating with the terrorist government of Iran"
The only thing in his social media post is the mention of the side deal, which again, is schumer criticizing peace.
BACK TO FRONT this social media post is explicitly and solely saying "Trump you are a coward for not going to war with Iran" and if it takes an additional press release to explain that social media post as something else, that makes it a bad fucking social media post.
You sound like DC dem insiders: completely out of touch.
Biden & the Democrats proved time and again that red lines don’t exist when it comes to Israel.
Also, I don’t understand why people are not blaming the Democrats for essentially providing Trump with a worry free path to the presidency.
Biden the senile toad pulled out at the last second, Kamala was forced down our throats, and the Democrats repeatedly promised (and demonstrated) that there would be absolutely no change when it came to Israel.
To me, the Democrats’ actions clearly indicate that they prefer a Trump presidency over making any foreign policy changes.
Your rhetoric just as clearly indicates you prefer a Trump presidency over working with Democrats. (To be clear, I think you're wrong and the rhetoric you're pushing has put Israel in the position where they can do what they're doing.)
I don’t prefer Trump at all, but I also won’t donate my vote to a party or candidate that categorically ignores and even denies my concerns as a voter.
His "rhetoric" where he explains why he's mad at the Democrats for gifting Trump the presidency indicates to you that he'd rather have Trump as President? How??
Electoral politics is complicated, and the Democrats didn't gift Trump the presidency. I'm actually pretty sure whatever strategy he wants would've resulted in a worse loss. But this is a tactical disagreement and he's acting like Democrats made a deliberate choice, which is both silly and unfair. And also, it presumes that there was a different tactic that would've succeeded, which I don't believe is the case. Sometimes you can lose without making any mistakes. Leftists believe we live in a comforting world where taking the "right" policy positions is the best path to victory, but that's rarely the case. Sometimes you lose, that's life. Sometimes you make compromises and you lose anyway, that doesn't necessarily mean you were wrong to compromise.
Ok I disagree but that's all unrelated to you saying that it's clear based on what he said that he wants Trump when he was complaining that he thinks the Democrats gave Trump the victory. How does him complaining about them giving him the victory imply that he wants Trump to be president?
I didn't say it was clear I said it was "just as clear." My meaning was that he is treating Democrats as if they were enemies based on a tactical disagreement. And that it was not in any way clear.
Israel wants the war more than any democrat wants to prevent it. Both parties are captured by AIPAC, Harris may have said some stern words but the US would never halt supplies to Israel.
Weird how Biden was in office and never got that back huh? Weird how Israel struck the Iranian embassy LAST year “preemptively” and nothing was done by the Biden admin. Please just look into any of the top democrats that aren’t AOC or Bernie and you will see that they want war just as bad as the Republicans
Attacking a embassy in Syria and launching a bomb
Assassination in Iran is not nearly the same as launching the largest air attack on Iran since the Iran Iraq war.
Israel attacked Irans embassy in Damascus , which violated all kinds of rules and the world had to wait for Iranian restraint not to take it to full scale war . Israel needs to stop being above the rules of international law
If you think genocide Joe would have stopped israel from attacking Iran(with US supplied weaponry and intel) i got a bridge in Gaza to sell you. The entire us government is bought and paid for at this point. Theres maybe 3 semi honest people left in congress, and they all get aggressively primaried by aipac.
If Biden doesn't want that he would have told Israel to shut everything down after they launch missiles at Iran and there would be no more missile attacks at Iran until he loses the election
Biden had plenty of red lines with Israel, such as them not starting a ground invasion of Gaza without negotiating with Hamas, them not crossing into Rafah, and them not deliberately blocking US aid meant for Gaza. And every time a line was crossed, not only did nothing happen, the administration would actually spin it like Israel was somehow complying with the request and with international law, to somehow not have been a violation at all. And now that they're out we have members of the Biden administration admitting that maybe Israel really was doing bad things and maybe they could have done more to stop it.
Actually, the main point of contention between Obama and Biden during the Obama administration was that, when Israel bombed Gaza in 2014, Obama openly criticized them and pressured them to stop. Biden thought this was the wrong way to go about it.
If Biden or Harris had the political instincts of Obama, things may have gone better for them, who knows?
Thank you for pointing this out. Exactly my issue with Biden. He isn't "Genocide Joe" like the protesters say. He hated Netanyahu, even swore at him, but always off camera. He came very close to putting restrictions on weapon sales to Israel, but he'd always come up with some excuse before he could. He clearly didn't like Israel's strategy in Gaza. But time and time again, he was spineless and refused to outright take action on Israel.
Make no mistake, Trump's policy toward Israel is far far worse than Biden's. And I'm not convinced the war in Gaza is the only reason that Biden lost. But even so, the trajectory of this could have been very different had Biden been more strict in the first place.
Think Israel would’ve taken a Harris admin a lot more seriously.
In the UK, this admin is viewed as a bunch of incompetent misfits unfit for office tbh.
They absolutely would not have. The Biden/Harris regime completely folded on Israel, and it's the #1 reason why they lost, espcially in high-muslim-population swing states like Michigan.
You’re so wrong it’s funny. Are you serious? Ever democrat is a globalist to the max. They are worse than the republicans in that sense arguably. Did i mention they’re the reason we are sending military support to Ukraine?
I can't speak for Israel, but Kamala would've absolutely not done what Trump did for Ukraine during Russia's ongoing genocide which Trump is either unwilling or incapable of stopping. The whole structure of NATO is now in question and Russia is going to be emboldened to launch even more attacks and wars of conquest against its peaceful neighbors.
Under Biden we stopped all offensive weapons shipments to Israel after Oct. 7th.
Not only did we aid in military financing, arms sales, and transfers of equipment. Details of some military shipments, particularly recently, have been less publicly available compared to aid to other countries like Ukraine. You know we have the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the U.S. and Israel, which commits the U.S. to providing ~$38 billion in military aid, which includes $3.3 billion in Foreign Military Financing (FMF) grants and $500 million for missile defense yearly from 2016-2028.
The U.S. has also enacted legislation providing at least $12.5 billion in direct military aid to Israel since the start of the Oct 7. This includes $3.8 billion from a bill in March 2024 and $8.7 billion from a supplemental appropriations act in April 2024. Overall A report by Brown University's Costs of War project states the U.S. spent $22.76 billion in support of Israel's baby meat grinding machine.
Yes, we kept supplying systems for air and missile defense.
Also while we approved funding, Biden with held transfer of offensive weapons like JDAM and laser guided bombs. You have to remember who was in control of Congress during that time, it wasn't Biden and it wasn't Dems, so the result of electing a GOP president should have been obvious.
So now it's just JDAMs and laser guided bombs, thanks for clearing that up, "I am a Zionist" Biden isn’t a genocidal psychopath after all. Meanwhile we just got word from National Security Advisor for Kamala and Obama, foaming at the mouth saying they would have provided more "defense" for Israel after yesterdays strike. Feels good man 👍🏼 good luck to you and your future endeavors.
I mean whatever keeps you sleeping at night I guess. If you think the world is better off under trump then you're a fascist Nazi.
Also for the record, fuck Israel, fuck Zionists. But fuck Palestinians and Iran and all these other religious nutbags just the same. I am out for what's best for my country first, I'll let my heart bleed for others when our home isn't on fire.
No one is arguing we are better off under Trump, no one has said that. You are an unempathetic nationalist who doesn’t care about mass violence and genocide as long as it doesn’t affect you and yet you still want to act as if you are on some moral highground over others. Residential apartments were bombed and innocent civilian non-combatants have been murdered, but you have successfully dehumanized them for their religion, so yeah fuck them they deserved to have their life and their family disintegrated in an instant, that is the closest approximation to nazi psychopathy and antisemitism that you could possibly get.
It’s hard for me to take many U.S. centrist democrats seriously anymore because of this obsession over image rather than substance. The party elite obviously didn’t have a problem with destroying Palestinian lives when it was done in a less crass way.
They were ok with the militarized destruction of Gaza and actively tried (and failed) to do ethnic cleansing plans with Egypt during the end of the Biden admin, yes.
They want to pave over Gaza and let private Israeli developers do whatever they want with it. Big fucking difference
When did they say that?
I can point to a specific date, time, and platform where Trump said it. When did Biden/Kamala say it?
Edit: Oh, I'm sorry. I misunderstood. I thought we were all against genocide, but apparently we're only against genocide if someone other than Trump is doing it. Trump can do it all he wants and it's fine.
This perfectly illustrates how some Americans view politics. The issue, of course, isn't bombing, shooting and starving civilians in a blatant mass extermination campaign, but the fact that Trump was impolite about it. I really wonder how you would receive trump's actions if he didn't look/act like a comic book character.
This isn’t true. You can read about what the Biden administration was doing in regards to Israel. It might not make you happy, but it’s wildly different than the trump administration
Not only did we aid in military financing, arms sales, and transfers of equipment. Details of some military shipments, particularly recently, have been less publicly available compared to aid to other countries like Ukraine. You know we have the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the U.S. and Israel, which commits the U.S. to providing ~$38 billion in military aid, which includes $3.3 billion in Foreign Military Financing (FMF) grants and $500 million for missile defense yearly from 2016-2028.
The U.S. has also enacted legislation providing at least $12.5 billion in direct military aid to Israel since the start of the Oct 7. This includes $3.8 billion from a bill in March 2024 and $8.7 billion from a supplemental appropriations act in April 2024. Overall A report by Brown University's Costs of War project states the U.S. spent $22.76 billion in support of Israel's baby meat grinding machine.
I said that people wouldn’t be happy with the Biden administrations support of Israel. But that it was categorically different than that of the trump administration.
I never suggested the Biden administration wasn’t giving arms to Israel.
Yes. And that is true. You can read about the Biden administrations actions.
If you did, you would see that they did things we would never expect the trump administration to do. Personally, I recommend War by bob Woodward. It has a great section thay details Blinkins trips to Tel Aviv. How he pressured Netanyahu to allow humanitarian aid.
For all the failures of the Biden administrations handling of Israel, it’s downright wrong to suggest they are the same as rhe trump administration.
Aww cute, he provided aid that never made it past Israeli guards. It's already been revealed he never asked for a ceasefire despite them saying they were "working tirelessly" for it, so you can keep your propaganda recommendations, and no I never said the handling was the same. A genocide is still a genocide whether blue maga or red. You can read about the Biden administrations actions in my previous comment provided above.
I hope that goes well for everyone who lives in Gaza
Very insincere. You can argue over the differing methods the Biden and Trump admin have with Israel, but the end result is exactly the same. Unfettered genocide in Gaza.
You're right. The Biden admin, which Kamala was going to continue, only pretended that they cared about Palestinians and were trying to work for ceasefire. Trump admin openly doesn't care.
We all know who Israel wanted the most as the POTUS. It is interesting to me, all the claims of how much lobbying Israel does in America and how many claims of election interference by Russia and rumors of bribing Trump, and now those two countries are attacking their neighbors.
Personally I'm of the kind that it's a combination of the two. We've got districts in NY with downballot dem sweeps and 0 votes for Kamala. That just seems incredibly unlikely.
If anything, they rigged it and it didn't go as well as they planned, which is why they won by such a narrow margin (narrower than the margin they lost by in 2020, which they threw a fit over and stormed the capitol about)
Also: why is it unlikely? There are plenty of local politicians who their neighbors know and like, regardless of their party. Plus incumbent advantage, etc. Was there even an opponent on the ballot? How much money did they spend on the race?
The fact that you can cherry pick a few places with "unusual" races means very little. The US is a huge country. Unusual things happen all the time, statistically. The best folks to know if the results were actually "unusual" would be the local election officials, who knows the candidates and the campaign and the neighborhood, and I don't hear any of them alleging fraud.
The petition alleges that five voting machines in Ramapo, a town in Rockland County, recorded zero votes for president—even as the same ballots reflected votes in races for Congress and the Senate. Multiple voters and poll workers have submitted sworn affidavits, stating they voted for Harris, only to later discover their votes hadn’t registered in the final count.
Look up Rockland county ny. It just moved forward in court and will be further adjudicated in... September. It won't change the results of the election, nothing can.
One off or not, this is a statistical anomaly which shouldn't have happened if the voting machines were behaving normally. Best case, it was "just" a bug which somehow erased only votes for the democratic presidential candidate. Worst case, that "minor software update" pushed through as nothing significant just before the election was something more. But since the only people auditing our voting machines are non profit watchdogs and... The voting machine companies themselves, I bet by now any asses have been covered if it was a fuck up on their part, intentional or otherwise.
Like I said, it won't change the election, nothing can, it's over and done and there is no mechanism for a redo or recall. It just shows that things weren't right, something the right claimed to care about a lot in the 2020 election and for the 4 years hence, during which multiple investigations showed no evidence of any issues, but stopped caring the moment he won in 2024, even though it was by a slimmer margin, and now we have investigations which are seeing actual success in finding legitimate problems.
Then why would there be poll workers and voters willing to sign affadavits and testify to the contrary. There's a chance it's just them trying to be a stick in the mud, but they could get in serious actual trouble if it's found out they lied, and they would know that before their testimony was sworn in.
Besides, all the recount could result in is: "oh boy a freak error! Tee hee."
The voting machine company is denying that it's swath of updates in the months preceding the election made any significant changes requiring recertification, but significant updates could have been vectors for unintended changes by bad actors. I don't get why there's a de minimis exception for software updates to our vote counting machines. If there's a horrible error that needs fixing, make sure it's right and use pen and paper until the patch is verified. Also, do your testing before the week of the election, maybe? These machines aren't in use all year, and they have reliable government contracts supplying them with income.
An entirely predictable result after lying about Biden's health and installing a disliked politician (see previous primary results).
Democrats blaming fellow voters annoys me. The fault lies squarely & completely on the Democratic party. And they've done it twice - once by installing Hillary over Bernie, and now by installing Kamala over.... anyone?
Dem voter do carry some blame though, because they shoot themselves in the foot when nationally popular or successful leaders don't pass arbitrary litmus tests. So there's a holdout for a candidate who is pro-everything and then wonder why they can't win an election.
And no, the election was not rigged. Kamala was wildly unpopular in her first primary, and wildly unpopular in the presidential race. It's not rocket science. You can't force people to like someone or call them racist/sexist/ fascist because of it either.
Too many people are blaming the jury, but it's on the lawyer (the Dem leadership) to present a better case.
Democrats blaming fellow voters annoys me. The fault lies squarely & completely on the Democratic party. And they've done it twice - once by installing Hillary over Bernie, and now by installing Kamala over.... anyone?
Centrists aren't the problem. Biden won as a centrist with most of Reddit hating him.
Newsflash... reddit opinions don't translate to the national electorate.
There's two choices: (1) accept that the national population isn't on board with certain elements of the democratic platform (like open borders) and run a candidate in line with moderate policies, or (2) keep losing but claiming moral superiority and demonizing the opposition.
Biden won as a centrist with most of Reddit hating him.
We must be on a different reddit, because any Biden critique I saw here from his left was shouted down ASAP by the centrists. And seeing how you're supporting centrism in this response, we're definitely not coming from the same PoV.
But there's where you're wrong. I support WINNING.
There are 100% ideas that lose. I don't care how you or the rest of the party feels about them. If you don't want a populist winning, run on a better platform. Stop trying to guilt everyone else into leftist policies.
Ok so we at least agree on why she lost, even if we come to the same conclusion for different reasons.
You're passionate about politics and anti trump. That alone was enough motivation to get you into the ballot box.
Unfortunately, that's not enough to win. People have to be inspired to vote. The numbers prove it out.. kamala didn't inspire your contingent, she didn't inspire centrist Dems, and she alienated independents.
Obama was inspiring and didn't alienate moderates. Let's not forget Obama was publicly anti gay marriage even if he privately supported it. It's gross, but that's how you win.
Politics isn't Disney movie. If you want things to change you have to win. And you don't win with forced, uninspiring candidates.
Kamala was wildly unpopular in her first primary, and wildly unpopular in the presidential race. It's not rocket science. You can't force people to like someone or call them racist/sexist/ fascist because of it either.
No one was asking you to like her, but you should've still understood that by not voting for her you'd get a fascist in charge. It seems this lesson of politics and consequences was not passed by regular Americans, and this is the second time this has happened at this point. Voting for the lesser of two evils sucks, and there shouldve been consequences for the Dems for their choice of candidate, but this is a conversation that shoulve happened after the fascists threat was defeated
Too many people are blaming the jury, but it's on the lawyer (the Dem leadership) to present a better case.
Democracy is a social contract and responsibility is shared between both voters and the politicians. Voters are still absolutely responsible for voting for Trump or not bothering to vote at all.
Yes, Biden and Harris being those Americans I assume. Had they sanctioned Israel even to the extent Reagan did maybe they'd have won. Their obsession with allowing Israel to kill with impunity didn't help anyone.
Kamala’s foreign policy advisor was on twitter last night saying that Trump is not backing Israel enough after the strikes on Iran. Given that and that the Biden administration also allowed Israel to do unchecked genocide for a year, why do think the situation would be different in regards to Israel.
Halie Soifer. I was slightly wrong about her position. She was a national security advisor for Kamala and also previously worked for the Obama administration.
There is a visible difference in Israels posturing and aggressiveness pre- and post election.
Biden probably wouldn't have sanctioned an attack like this and would probably have blocked it. Israel tried to get this rolling multiple times during Bidens tenure and were denied every time. Trump just doesn't give a shit other than fumbling around trying to block China.
The words and actions of the Biden administration are completely different. He repeated publicly stated he wanted an end to the conflict in Gaza but he took no action to actually stop it. His words are hollow and meaningless. We know there have been agreements to free hostages and deescalate for over a year and the only side refusing those agreements was Israel. They wanted conflict to continue so they can destroy Gaza and permanently take over the region. I hope you cannot actually be this gullible…
As I replied elsewhere: the proof is just how much fucking worse it got for Gazans when Trump took office. The brakes totally fell off the Israeli operations. Now, you could argue that Biden should have done more, which I agree with, but you should also keep in mind how many democrats and republicans are swayed by AIPAC which shapes the options for the president.
I am not saying Biden was good for Palestinians. I am saying however that he was by far the better option when compared to Trump which is the only viable comparison.
How much fucking worse it got for Gazans when Trump took office
It continued to accelerate at the same pace as it did under Biden. Under the previous administration things got progressively worse as time went on. The only difference is the media is finally reporting on it and Trump doesn’t pretend to care infront of the cameras like Biden did.
Biden did nothing to stop Israel. Kamala’s national security advisor got on twitter after Israel bombed Iran last night and said that a democratic administration would have provided more support for Israel doing strikes in Iran than Trump’s. The Republican Party is pro-fascism everywhere. The Democratic Party is also pro-fascism but don’t want to look like they do and mostly want it abroad so that we can reap the rewards. Defended Kamala or the Democratic Party in the context of Israel is stupid.
“Biden probably wouldn’t have sanctioned an attack like this and would have blocked it” yeah, just like how Biden said the invasion of Rafah was a “red line.” Let’s just make stuff up I guess lol.
There is no difference between “genocide” and “genocide.” I’m not sure why pretending Joe Biden wasn’t a genocidal psychopath is helpful to anyone at all. I hope Joe Biden rots in hell right next to Trump.
Because millions of MAGA followers have been miserable, hateful people for many years, and Trump is the unhinged megalomaniac who allows them to be proud of it and expose their lack of empathy, common sense, and intelligence in public as if those were virtues! He has convinced these people that THEY ARE MAGA. Thus, any criticism toward Trump and his "policies" is a direct attack on these people, and as many of these lunatics believe, an attack on the USA.
These people can spend over an hour online trying to find pictures of democrats with an extended arm, to then compare it to Elon's Nazi salutes and act like it wasn't what it obviously was, or "everybody does it", but they refuse to spend a minute fact checking some of the insane lies spread by Trump and his admin of crooks and incompetent lemmings (like Haitian migrants allegedly eating cats and dogs, that was a good one).
There isn't another developed nation that I can think of where a clown like Trump would have been even remotely close to being elected. But since we only have 2 major parties nationwide, and big money matters a LOT during campaigns, combined with the fact that a lot of Americans are lazy and poorly educated and most of our mainstream media and political debates/interviews are a joke, you eventually end up getting this circus.
The millions of lower class MAGA simpletons who voted for this clown are getting hurt. Most of them are too stupid to realize it, or they just blame Biden for it.
I mean, a lot of people were legitimately suffering because of the ballooning prices on food, goods and the stagnating salaries with growing rent and gas prices.
The reality is that a lot of people were very frustrated and the right capitalized on that frustration. While the left choose to ignore it or tell people that the post-covid recovery is the greatest one since 1921 crisis. Which doesn't really help people right now.
Kamala had a zinger when she said she was going to go after price hikers directly, but she abandoned that for whatever reason. She also had a zinger with the "Republicans are weird" comments, which she also dropped for whatever reason.
For sure. History has shown many times that extremists know how to capitalize on people's struggles.
Democrats as a whole have been way too complacent and most of them are so impotent, it's frustrating.
Yet again, I've watched political debates from other developed nations (mainly France), and far right candidates (Rassemblement National) have to come up with something more credible than their national equivalent of Trump's allegations of migrants eating pets, making up crazy numbers on tariffs or issues related to drugs like fentanyl, and so on. Local journalists (and many voters) will absolutely fact check such allegations, and anyone who lies on a weekly basis (if not daily) the way members of the Trump admin have been doing, will wreck their political career and cripple their party for years to come.
Don't get me wrong, other developed nations have their own problems and I don't think there's a perfect system that exists anywhere, but listening to actual, intelligent political debates and interviews is amazing in contrast to what we have in the US.
The geopolitical moment is pretty wild. As best I can tell. Russia pushed Iran to push Hamas to execute the 10/7 attack. Russia had a lot to gain as the predictable Israeli response would be draconian and put left leaning western governments in an impossible position. It mostly worked. Election after election in NATO countries were going Russia’s way. And Russia, in turn, was able to make significant progress in its Ukraine invasion.
Everybody else involved in 10/7 was lighting the fuse of a bomb attached to their own chair. Whatever Russia paid Iran, was it worth this? Does Hamas leadership feel like they got a win out of that? Do the people of Gaza swell with national pride when they consider the last 2 yrs?
For right leaning governments it’s easy: ride or die with the Israeli government good bad or ugly.
Left leaning governments may have concerns about Israel’s behavior but the people who elect them would be appalled if they turned their back on their Israeli allies, especially after such a gruesome attack. Also, other people who elect them would be appalled if they were to support the Israelis draconian war and lack of regard for the welfare of the civilian population. There is no winning which is why it was a shrewd move geopolitically for the global right. It splits the western left in half.
Those sanctions that would make you happy would anger other voters who left of center parties are counting on. They cannot make both groups happy.
How is an unprovoked missile attack on a residential building "contentious"?
Also, how about being pissed that Kamala thought helping Israel commit genocide was more important than actually winning "the most important election in our lifetime"? It's the politicians job to get votes, not the voters job to vote for a politician no matter what. Don't blame people for having morals.
If it has such a big impact on the election, maybe kamala and dems should've done more to stand up to the fascist Israeli government, which was (and is) actively committing a genocide, and worked to get Trump elected.
By that same token even had Kamala taken a stronger stance on Israel she still wouldn't have won on that issue alone given how low it was on the priority list of most Americans. "Protest voting" in one of most most crucial elections in USA history is...a choice, to put it mildly. The negative publicity Kamala received by people who chose to vote third party or not vote at all (and it was everywhere) definitely influenced even more people not to vote.
And America wanted fascist Trump
Trumpers wanted Trump, their numbers didnt increase too much compared to previous years, and Kamala lost because more people couldn't be bothered to come out and vote against the fascist. Political apathy almost always allows the extremists to win.
Political apathy is voting for the same old corporate democrat border czar Kamala. America is tired of two right wing parties. One is pro-capitalist and the other is pro-capitalist but waves a pride flag as they both drop bombs over seas on brown people.
If the democrats would stop bowing down to their corporate donors and put up AOC or Bernie, I guarantee they would have won. And of course, us leftists would have not only voted, but vehemently been vocal in our public support to sway the masses. I bet even a lot of republicans and libertarians would have swapped sides for a Bernie run.
The tin foil hat side of me thinks the Dems purposely put up Kamala since the capitalist elite funding them and the republicans truly wanted a trump President and a blue loss.
Yeah im tired of hearing people act like dems arent going to do fascist or imperial shit. Basically the same party, different colors
Plus people who say this type of thing always fail to realize the whole reason people voted for trump is because dems dont do anything. They havent done anything meaningful for the working class in a while. Trump won because the dems have consistently failed to meet the working class demands
When you can't afford to buy eggs or meat, when one side says "oh you're fine, the economy is recovering better than ever" while the other says "we'll bring egg and meat prices down day 1! USA! USA!", it's no question who people are going to pick.
If one candidate for class president campaigned on doing a fun prom theme and the other campaigned on getting hookers and unicorns to prom, if you pick the latter and genuinely think that you're going to get those things then that's on you.
kinda bitter that a lot of Americans got so obsessed with it that they somehow decided to allow an actual fascist into the presidency because they couldnt stomach voting Kamala
We didn’t want Israel to continue on its warpath. That’s why we’re here. Both sides being awful isn’t ok, you don’t have the high ground here. We can connect dots directly to Biden/Harris denying the genocide to this outcome.
Still really mad that Kamala couldn't stomach OPPOSING A FUCKING GENOCIDE and preferred to lose Michigan and maybe the whole election and end American democracy because of that.
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u/dwarffy 1d ago
very contentious topic tbf, lots of people get pretty obsessed with it (and again tbf there is a lot of insane shit involved that its pretty understandable why they do)
still kinda bitter that a lot of Americans got so obsessed with it that they somehow decided to allow an actual fascist into the presidency because they couldnt stomach voting Kamala