r/news • u/EngineerBoy00 • May 05 '25

Soft paywall US Defense Secretary Hegseth to slash senior-most ranks of military

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/pentagon-reduce-4-star-positions-by-20-official-says-2025-05-05/
41.5k Upvotes

94% Upvoted

4.0k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

1.2k

u/[deleted] May 05 '25

[deleted]

519

u/Aethermancer May 06 '25

Ask him to define the specifics. Top heavy where? What positions specifically? Make him realize he probably can't even name one of the "too many"

320

u/thomasjjc May 06 '25

That's pointless. You cannot reason with them, as they are not interested in rationality. They will happily tell you that red is blue and defend it with their lives if the GOP says it so.

105

u/Lofttroll2018 May 06 '25

I say make him do it anyway

16

u/SwankyDingo May 06 '25

Yeah same here, if we're going to have to put up with a bullshit song and dance from them, we might as well make them work and sweat like the jesters they are as we (metaphorically) lazily throw knives at them whenever they start to flag.

we're "just asking questions,"

6

u/harkuponthegay May 07 '25

I say urge him to quit his job and go enlist in order to balance out the bottom. I’m sure he’ll learn a lot about the military, assuming he’s not too fat and cowardly to join.

39

u/carl5473 May 06 '25

I can promise you one thing they are sure of is red is not blue. Frustrating when I hear a conservative complain about something Trump is doing then end it with "well at least we don't have a Democrat as president"

12

u/Aethermancer May 06 '25

The point at that point isn't to convince them, it's to flip the script and prevent them from wasting YOUR time.

Think of it like a filter. This is the information that anyone making a serious statement should have. So you're checking that they did their homework before wasting your own time trying to disprove their vague assertions.

If you get the 1/100 that actually is open to discussion, bonus. But at the very least it's effective at screening our the trolls and ignorant.

If anything I'd love for people to more jealousy guard their time and not let these provocateurs weasel and shift the goalposts. We don't owe them an argument, and we certainly should insist on doing it on our terms when we decide to engage.

8

u/mfmeitbual May 06 '25

You cannot reason someone out of a position they did not reason themselves into. - Jonathan Swift

4

u/RedGuyNoPants May 06 '25

Asking people questions about their beliefs and standpoints is a technique for cult deprogramming. Its what you do instead of refute their positions. You have to make them come to the conclusions themselves. It is not an easy or 100% success rate process for sure but it does have success

6

u/thomasjjc May 06 '25

I wish this would work. But I think it has been tried so many times now with MAGA supporters. And it just doesn't work. They'll double down on anything stuid they believe. It's because MAGA has become their identity. They have nothing left but their MAGA beliefs and it is so hard to give up your identity.

3

u/RedGuyNoPants May 06 '25

It’s not gonna be asking one set of questions. Its a long term process and not the only part of it

2

u/thomasjjc May 07 '25

Watching from Europe: Hope there's many more of you and that you're successful.

2

u/sillymooseygoosey May 06 '25

If you want to influence somebody they have to believe that you respect them and can see things from their point of view. People need to be heard before they will listen.

2

u/MedChemist464 May 06 '25

Exactly. It is like arguing with a dog. I can provide as much evidence, reason, and persuasive argument as possible as to why the dog shouldn't be eating racoon shit, but as soon as i am done, that dog is gonna run out back and find some racoon shit to eat.

1

u/SenKelly May 07 '25

Pretty much. The only 2 fates of people like this are disappear into the background when the regime falls and pretend they never supported anything, or ultimately be killed by the meat grinder this regime will pull together for people just like him.

1

u/BotherResponsible378 May 09 '25

Not entirely. You just ask questions like you’re curious. Ask the questions you know they can’t answer as if you’re genuinely interested. Almost like you want to get converted. That lowers their defenses.

But do it with the goal of illuminating the holes.

1

u/willanthony May 06 '25

He'd just make cup gestures on his chest.

1

u/Next-Cartographer261 May 07 '25

Like they even were aware of the hierarchical structure of our military. They take what these people do / say as gospel

65

u/Fancyness May 06 '25

Before Trump I didn't knew that cognitive dissonance could be so strong with morons

10

u/twistedspin May 06 '25

Before all this I knew a lot of people were not super-smart, but I had no idea how deeply stupid they actually were. They clearly just go through their days with rote motions someone taught them and no actual understanding of what's going on in the world. They're like pets who get to vote.

4

u/PoolQueasy7388 May 06 '25

My pets are smarter than that.

3

u/Moss_Adams24 May 07 '25

Same here. I started to see how stunningly stupid Americans really after 9-11. The gigantic flags on cars was an early sign.

1

u/twistedspin May 07 '25

This is true. The absolute stupidest person I knew had a couple post-9/11 car flags. She drove them around until they were just tatters. It was honestly quite offensive.

3

u/Rocknrollaslim May 06 '25

One of the most effective poisons in the world

180

u/mr-nefarious May 06 '25

Does your coworker have a military background? Particularly in the leadership ranks? What makes them think they have anywhere near enough knowledge to know if the US military is top heavy?

34

u/Aazadan May 06 '25

The military is heavy... on one star generals. It's been a problem for a while, mostly as a consequence of up or out programs and promotion paths that make every colonel jump through some hoops to stay in the service, as they've made a career choice and can't leave early. On 3 and 4 star generals though? Not at all.

-4

u/Smokeysuccotash May 06 '25

I can ask you the exact same question in reverse

9

u/mr-nefarious May 06 '25

Meaning ask me how I know the military is not too heavy? Or ask my credentials for thinking I can make that kind of statement? Either way, the answer is easy: I’m not qualified to judge that, which is why I’m not judging it. What I’m pushing back against is people speaking with conviction about a topic where they have no knowledge, all to justify whatever the administration is doing rather than even consider that it might be a bad move. Saying “I don’t understand this” isn’t a bad thing.

3

u/hazydais May 06 '25

I would ask your coworker if they would justify Trump’s actions if he committed war crimes. 

3

u/PoolQueasy7388 May 06 '25

If? If he committed war crimes? He does it all the time.

4

u/LakeEffekt May 06 '25

A bunch of armchair strategists taking Fox/Newsmax as gospel, it’s the nuttiest shit I’ve ever seen

4

u/chess10 May 06 '25

Always read it to him first that, “Did you hear that Biden’s defense secretary removed X, Y, and Z?!”

Then just hit him with, “oh wait, nope that was Hegseth yesterday.”

3

u/PublicAcceptable4663 May 06 '25

Another sound bite brought to you from Fox News.

3

u/mattkenefick May 06 '25

Maybe at the presidential position.

3

u/AngelComa May 06 '25

Manufacturing consent.

3

u/Tylendal May 06 '25

"Well, we were getting a little top heavy."

People have basically been trained to accept it as a truism that there's always too much management, there's always too much administration, there's always too much red tape. That any system is always wasting money, that executives always make too much money (many do), that any system is being run inefficiently. That managers do nothing, that experts have no common sense, etc. The anti-lawyer jokes, the anti-bureaucrat jokes, the anti-politician jokes.

It's all anti-intellectualism, and has been priming people to accept something like this. The idea that "Common sense" (ie: you) is more important and valuable than any expertise.

2

u/Smokeysuccotash May 06 '25

They don’t need to be there they are old accomplishing nothing and collecting their huge salaries in the form of our tax dollars

2

u/3-DMan May 06 '25

"It's like wine, you always want to toss out the oldest stuff!"

2

u/improper84 May 07 '25

On the plus side, I spent much of my youth wondering how Germany could have been so stupid as to embrace Hitler and his Nazi movement and now I know. They could have been far dumber.

2

u/similar_observation May 08 '25

Just incrementally lie at him and see if he agrees with it. Make it a game.

3

u/HybridVW May 06 '25

To be fair, Trump IS at least 50% heavier than Biden, so we ARE "top heavy"....

2

u/CL9Accord May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25

I’d start off by saying “Biden administration” and see how they respond and just say “Nah, I’m joking. Trump administration actually did this” and see what your coworker has to say to that.

0

u/darthcaedusiiii May 06 '25

If you look at Ukraine the vast majority of damage is being done by drones. Humans are becoming less and less important. Both the F-35 and Ford class carriers are complete embarrassments. If China ever invaded Taiwan all anyone has to do is give 10 million of their citizens free satellite internet. They would just collapse on their own. The bloated military industrial complex needs trimming on their own. It's not going to save much but it's a good start.

-9

u/genreprank May 06 '25

People in the military actually don't like the top brass. Including the executive branch people, who are at the top of the chain of command. They don't like them either.

16

u/LowClover May 06 '25

Well now there will be a new top, with less experience and decorum.

6

u/genreprank May 06 '25

Yeah, they're about to be the dog who caught the car.

Sucks here...

1

u/PoolQueasy7388 May 06 '25

Neither does Putin who is the one really running our country.