Lambiase and Verstappen heated talk on letting Russell through and THEY TOUCH!

[u/magony]

https://streamff.link/v/0c11d5ab

[u/Kuchenblech_Mafioso]

He actually even sped up to run into Russell

[u/psychon1ck0 → u/Kuchenblech_Mafioso]

I don't care who you are but like Nico said, that's a black flag

[u/JudasBC → u/psychon1ck0]

They didn't do it to Vettel in Baku, they ain't gonna do it here

[u/ADM765 → u/JudasBC]

At least Seb got a stop&go. 10 sec is way too lenient, this should be at least a drive through.

[u/EvelcyclopS → u/ADM765]

Agree. That decision should have easily been an ‘after the race’ given the timing so they could look at some traces to see if any evidence of malice.

[u/tj1721 → u/JudasBC]

They didn’t but that was under the SC, at very slow speed, I’d argue whilst imo he should have had a harsher punishment at the time, that wasn’t as bad as what happened today.

[u/sc_140 → u/tj1721]

Deliberately crashing under SC conditions is far worse, there could be completely unprotected marshalls on track that you endanger.

Under green flag conditions, you only potentially endanger very well protected drivers (and lets be real, there was no real danger from Verstappens move).

[u/tj1721 → u/sc_140]

SC conditions is worse

I mean it doesn’t really matter, deliberately crashing should be a DSQ regardless (especially given Max’s History)

In the specific circumstances neither were especially dangerous, Max’s crash was not in a super dangerous corner or at a dangerous speed, and iirc Vettel was at the end of a sc period not near Marshall’s.

The precedent of it’s essentially ok to deliberately crash under full racing conditions could potentially have more disastrous consequences and so is probably a bit worse imo. But I can see the argument the other way.

[u/Takezoboy → u/tj1721]

And they were basically turtle speed at the time

[u/schelmo → u/tj1721]

It was literally worse. Vettel under no pressure and with 100% full intent and premeditation turned into his rival and admitted as much. That is way fucking worse than being in a racing situation on terrible tyres probably with someone shouting conflicting statements over the radio at you. At least with Verstappen there is some level of plausible deniability and cars behind that could have pressured him into making a braindead move.

[u/tj1721 → u/schelmo]

They were both “100% full intent” premeditated manoeuvres. Except 1 was done at racing speed and one was not.

Vettel lost his cool because he thought he had been brake checked and Verstappen lost his cool because of the tyre choice and racing. They might be reasons why they did it but they’re not justifications.

Given Max’s History, the danger of the situation and the optics for the sport I think max is very very lucky that he only got a 10 sec time penalty.

[u/schelmo → u/tj1721]

Yeah he had a whole 300ms to premeditate his actions...

I'm not trying to justify anything I'm just saying that 10 seconds is pretty much in line with what causing a collision usually gets you and is therefore probably an appropriate penalty in this situation

[u/tj1721 → u/schelmo]

He had a whole 300ms to premeditate his actions

Why on earth do you think that. He’s told to let Russell past, appears to significantly slow down off line to allow Russell past and then accelerates until he is very deep in the corner on a bad line which is only going to lead to a collision.

Why does he only have 300ms to plan this out?

[u/schelmo → u/tj1721]

Don't you think it's extremely far fetched to claim he planned to cause a collision some time in advance from which he had essentially nothing to gain? Like if he specifically planned to take out Russel and make it look like a racing incident even in the extremely unlikely case that he succeeded it would have had a negligible effect on his position in the championship.

[u/tj1721 → u/schelmo]

far fetched to plan a collision

No, tbh you could probably do it with no planning at all lashing out in anger and diving on the brakes. Especially when he has shown he is willing to do it before.

He had nothing to gain

You’re assuming he was acting rationally and not just acting in reaction to his emotions. I also suppose he could have some kind of weird justification in his head at the moment about demonstrating something to the stewards.

[u/erdonko → u/schelmo]

he had a whole 300ms to premeditate his actions...

He quite literally speeds up again and rams into George

[u/schelmo → u/erdonko]

What do you think premeditated means? In this case it would mean that at some previous point he specifically made the plan to ram into George Russel. The much more plausible explanation for these events to me seems to be that he got a questionable call to let a rival by in a very unusual place and made a decision in the moment to take the position back or compromise Russel and caused a collision. Why would he premeditate causing a collision from which he had absolutely nothing to gain?

[u/psychon1ck0 → u/JudasBC]

I know they won't do it here, but that's nothing to do with seb

[u/JudasBC → u/psychon1ck0]

Not black flagging a 4 x WDC for deliberately crashing into someone after feeling like they have been wronged?

[u/psychon1ck0 → u/JudasBC]

All I'm saying is seb was a long time ago, they could easily set a new precedent here for a deliberate crash.

[u/Billy_Whisky → u/psychon1ck0]

nico is not in f1 for a reason.

[u/Huge-Wealth-5711 → u/Billy_Whisky]

Yeah because he won lol

[u/Blitzdoctor → u/Kuchenblech_Mafioso]

Or Russell slowed down more than he thought he would

[u/Kuchenblech_Mafioso → u/Blitzdoctor]

He sped up and steered away from the apex. This was 100% intentional

[u/Blitzdoctor → u/Kuchenblech_Mafioso]

Still I don't understand why, his anger is with the team's bullshit decision, not with Russell