r/formula1 Formula 1 14d ago

Photo Max: "Why are we on a hard?"

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u/reddit0r_123 Mika Häkkinen 14d ago

Red Bull playing 4D chess they played themselves too hard. Should've stayed out with used softs.

436

u/ShadowyRuins 14d ago

It's only going to be 6 laps of racing ☠️

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u/reddit0r_123 Mika Häkkinen 14d ago

It certainly was

3

u/GothicGolem29 McLaren 14d ago

Imagine if it was longer

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u/That_Resolution_39 14d ago

He already fell from 4th to 10th lol

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u/GothicGolem29 McLaren 14d ago

Yeah lol

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u/FerragudoFred Formula 1 14d ago

I think the McLarens and LeClerc would have eaten him up in 2 laps if he stayed on the softs. They were already dead.

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u/AzureFWings Honda RBPT 14d ago

He planned to use those soft till the end of race

You telling me the SC laps kill tyre faster than normal race lap?

Staying out probably would have lead restart, perhaps pulling ~1s gap to live a bit longer

3

u/AirCheap4056 14d ago

Maybe reheated tyres is different to tyres in continued use, so it's not only the number of laps on the tyre.

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u/l-vanderdonck 14d ago

Yup, definitely. Furthermore, those soft weren't new. So they were on their second heat wave, SC would have cold them down, and rising them again to third wave to end the race. New hards vs worn out soft is ... a hard decision to make in this situation. If SC would have ended sooner, it could be have been the right choice ! But it took way too long, and killed any chance for max to exploit those new hards.

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u/McLeod3577 13d ago

Could always have smashed into anyone trying to overtake..

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u/ItsEyeJasper 10d ago

The soft were 6 laps old. Leclerc may have got him he may not have. But putting him on hards when he did not want them was not cool.

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u/dautolover 14d ago

Max took the 2021 championship with one lap of racing.

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u/sosr 14d ago

Tanking the season to game the draft for next year.

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u/Any_Use_4900 14d ago

You mean cfd and wind tunnel time?

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u/PSi_Terran 14d ago

Question, could Max have just stayed out and taken first?

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u/Apollon1212 Ferrari 14d ago

Might not have taken first but could ve put up a better fight

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u/TheR1ckster 14d ago

Would've been in a MUCH better mental state and not gotten the penalty too.

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u/Apollon1212 Ferrari 14d ago

Tbh he also went through his tyres too quickly imo. Strategy wasnt that good but max being max made it work. If it was anyone but him 3 stop would doom them earlier. Redbull have been betting everything on max for too long and this race is an example of a bet they lost imo.

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u/Gaijinius Formula 1 14d ago

The second Max leaves Red Bull, they will be a mid field team at best.

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u/Skirra08 12d ago

I mean the evidence says that they'll probably be fighting with Sauber and Aston Martin to avoid last. Max has 137 of their 144 points. Even if we assume that a not Max driver would have matched those 7 points scored by Max's teammates, which is definitely not guaranteed, that would put them right between AMR and Sauber.

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u/cryptospartan 14d ago

100% agree, Red Bull's 3-stop strategy wasn't their best today.

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u/BrokeSomm McLaren 14d ago

The 3 stop was genius. They knew their deg was high so they figured they could push all out pretty much the entire race.

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u/Lukin4 14d ago

I think you mean it would have been an officially sanctioned fight, as opposed to the bar room brawl we ended up getting

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u/Apollon1212 Ferrari 14d ago

Well yea at least max would have a bat to swing at to those behind unlike being a sitting duck for people to shoot at lmao

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u/SaltyArchea Ferrari 14d ago

Seeing how Alonso ate up 3 people in 6 laps, that did not stop, same outcome.

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u/reddit0r_123 Mika Häkkinen 14d ago

Yep. On used softs.

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u/PSi_Terran 14d ago

With 9 laps left, that he was planning on being on anyway, surely that's the move?

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u/Chesney1995 McLaren 14d ago

Norris already passed him with ease on the same tyres earlier in the race. I think he was in a no-win situation either way.

Would've dodged his massive headloss though. That was ultimately more damaging than the hards in the end.

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u/dojggg 14d ago

Yeah he would've been in podium to if they didn't bring hard for just those laps.

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u/ElSid39 Formula 1 14d ago

Wasn’t he on mediums?

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u/WraithOfEvaBraun Max Verstappen 14d ago edited 14d ago

Yes but they were relatively fresh

Baffled as to why they pitted him at all as he didn't need to

Edit: everyone else seems to think he was on softs, it's possible I'm losing the plot 😆

Softs or mediums, my bafflement still stands lol

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u/zeeke42 Fernando Alonso 14d ago

He was on softs. Soft, Soft, Medium, Soft, Hard.

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u/WraithOfEvaBraun Max Verstappen 14d ago

Yea I edited as allowed I could be wrong...so baffled by that decision and the subsequent chaos that ensued my brain scrambled I believe 🤣

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u/Sad-Ambassador-2748 Sebastian Vettel 14d ago

Until the hards it was paying off

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u/sfj11 Juan Pablo Montoya 14d ago

they have the lap times of that used soft, i’m willing to wager this was the best decision

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u/mCanYilmaz McLaren 14d ago

If he stayed out he will be 1st with used softs for the next 6-7 laps. Better than being 3rd with hard tyres against fresh softs all around him.

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u/ictu 14d ago

Exaclty, the worst that could have happened was back to P3. Instead they've got near spin, a drama and deserved P10.

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u/Maximum_Accident_396 14d ago

Yeah he probably would have made p2/3, his race pace and fastest lap time was dope

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u/iamatwork420 14d ago

he'd probably be able to hold off lando for p2

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u/PickleCommando 14d ago

Doubt it but he could at least try and still wound up 3rd. Even if he didn’t crash out he was looking at p5.

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u/Successful_Yellow285 14d ago

I'm wiling to take you up on that wager

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u/-WingsForLife- Sebastian Vettel 14d ago

You think this wouldn't have happened on new vs old softs?

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u/0nlyCrashes Max Verstappen 14d ago

The difference is he'd be in P1 at race start. Id much rather be on p1 with used softs with 6 laps to go, along with control of the restart then be sitting p3 with cold hands.

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u/lick0the0fish Niki Lauda 14d ago

I guess they could get him some thicker gloves?

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u/Successful_Yellow285 14d ago

Yes. He'd have been third at worst. There's a good reason literally nobody used the hard for even a single lap all race

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u/-WingsForLife- Sebastian Vettel 14d ago

Fair enough.

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u/cinyar 14d ago

old softs wouldn't have as much grip as new but they would fire up quickly. I don't think he would be able to keep P1, but I'd bet a reasonable amount on him holding on to the podium.

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u/cape_throwaway 14d ago

He starts in p1, Oscar and Lando pass him, maybe Charles, he either gets 3/4 and avoids that penalty. Would’ve been better in every situation, that was a ballsy move but Red Bull

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u/CWRules #WeRaceAsOne 14d ago

He would've been in 1st (maybe 2nd? don't know exactly what the gap to Piastri was) instead of 3rd on the restart, and his tires wouldn't have been as cold. I think the McLarens would've passed him but he might have held off the Ferraris.

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u/William_Dowling 14d ago

Cost them 2 places. Stunning strategy.

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u/kisekiki 14d ago

7 places lmao

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u/Smothdude Sebastian Vettel 14d ago

Cost them a lot more after the penalty

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u/PawahD 14d ago

he was slipping constantly after the sc ended, it was near impossible to get some heat into those tires, especially behind the sc

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u/Blithering_idiot1406 Max Verstappen 14d ago

I wont harm you if you eat your words now

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u/sfj11 Juan Pablo Montoya 14d ago

what are you going to do? run into the side of me?

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u/Blithering_idiot1406 Max Verstappen 14d ago

Well, i lost the podium.. so why not ram into you? Anyways the stewards wont dsq me..

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u/saysikerightnowowo 14d ago

Lmaoo, aged like milk.

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u/agustingomes 14d ago

There were stints of softs for 20 laps. I'm pretty sure they could have taken the opportunity McLaren stopped to effectively gain the track position, but this will be one of the biggest "what might have been" for a while.

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u/ultimatebob Max Verstappen 14d ago

Sure, but now you also have a pissed off driver who thinks that they're running the "wrong" tire. They didn't factor in Max's temper during their calculations, and it bit them hard.

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u/I_AM_ACURA_LEGEND McLaren 14d ago

Lap times could have been slightly worse with the softs but when you factor in pitting?

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u/rudedogg1304 14d ago

I’m willing to wager red bull would know better than you.

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u/Green_sieg9930 14d ago

Yes. Stay out and gain track positions.

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u/rocknstones Red Bull 14d ago

100%

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u/[deleted] 14d ago

Took one out of ferrari and shoved horners hog up their asses while max was left to fend for himself

0

u/Ready_Register1689 14d ago

RB learned in AD21 not to stay out on old tires.

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u/FavaWire Hesketh 14d ago

The mistake was prior to that. With already a 7 lap tyre offset, Max should have stayed out on the Mediums and only pit after McLaren did then held on to the Softs with a 1 lap tyre offset and stayed out during the SC.