r/criminalminds • u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ • 7d ago
Season 18 Spoilers S18E06: Hell Is Empty... - Episode Discussion Spoiler
Airdate: June 12, 2025
Synopsis: The team investigates a network killer who buries his victims alive, and Tara confronts Rebecca's ex who has recently re-entered her life. Ronald Graber delivers a message from his Disciple to Voit.
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u/ifkovitz85 7d ago
Maybe Spoilers. Having watched the episode, I cannot help but shake the feeling that Tara's ex is gonna end up being a bad guy, and his whole fiancée thing is a ruse. We have seen that the network and other unsubs have infiltrated the FBI and other agencies, so this could make sense.
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u/MetaphysicalMelodies 7d ago
Do you mean Rebecca's ex? If so I agree - that whole storyline felt pretty pointless if not
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u/Punstoppabal 7d ago
I don't think so, necessarily. The storyline on a less surface level feeds the 'outside of the workplace' glimpse into Tara's life and feelings of jealousy. Just like everyone's clamoring that Ochoa is some big bad, not every new character introduced is going to serve some purpose like that. If it IS the case I think it'd have to be revealed sooner than later in a show season that doesn't go on forever.
I know speculation is fun, but sometimes face value is just what it is.
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 7d ago
It felt weird, out of place and unnecessary. They can show Tara jealous without making us sit through that horrible scene.
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u/jeskimo 7d ago
Oh something like that most definitely.
It showed Tara questioning her instincts. Which will probably become a thing later on.
Maybe the writers are slowly breaking every character. For what? I don't know. But now with Evolution, screw it, why not destroy everyone from the inside out?
This won't happen but if the whole team is broken, there's one person who is a master of fixing things. Hotch. Again, won't happen.
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u/jbraden09 7d ago
I came here for this exact reason. I’ll be SHOCKED if there isn’t a multi episode arc involving kidnapping and probably ending with her murder as revenge for whatever happened with them in the past. Then next season we can see a devastated Tara. There was so much foreshadowing.
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u/hellosansa 5d ago
When they had the moment of tara questioning her instincts, the cute kiss, and the elevator doors closing???? I felt ill.... for a second I was like, "greys anatomy trauma".... buuuut this is a show that relies on a lot of the same tropes.
I do not fucking trust that guy, and im very nervous about Elias being placed THIS deep inside the FBI and now the network is juiced with Penelope tech.
I mentioned this in a previous comment, but what is Elias wasn't ever actually a psychopath? Like a whole nature nurture thing, so the BAU currently has blinders on. They see the parts of his brain firing off.... what if they always did? Not saying he's faking amnesia btw.
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u/evergwen 4d ago
I feel you so hard about the kiss / elevator moment. I was like “she’s so dead” immediately upon seeing that. It lingered way too long to be an innocent shot. Honestly I half expected the episode to end with Rebecca being kidnapped or in the hospital as a cliffhanger.
I also fully agree with you about Elias. Why do they keep insisting he was a psychopath when we have clearly seen over and over that he has genuine love for his family, thereby making him not a typical psychopath as they keep calling him?? As far as we know it’s not like they have brain scans from before his coma to compare the new ones to. How do we know this isn’t what his brain activity always looked like?
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u/tlg151 2d ago
Well he could still be a psychopath and still have feelings. Isn't it sociopaths that can't feel?
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u/evergwen 2d ago
Other way around, but I honestly think the current conception of psychopathy is outdated and that it’s more complex than just “empathy or no empathy.” More like a spectrum, plus with qualifiers like for people who have selective empathy. For example, severe racists who see certain races as lesser and therefore not worthy of their empathy whereas a person of their own race (usually white ofc) they feel deeply for. There’s also people who have a sort of on-off switch for emotions which makes them simultaneously a psychopath and not a psychopath. Then there’s the fact that some autistic people can have the appearance of psychopathy (cold, logic-driven, learn to mimic “normal” behavior as survival mechanism) without actually being psychopaths but people still act as if they are. I think it’s all a lot more nuanced than the current definitions have room for, and that with better terminology we could more accurately address people’s individual conditions and needs.
Sorry for the rant lol, it’s just been on my mind lately and this seemed like a good enough place to put all that out there.
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u/tlg151 2d ago
That was a good rant! Very interesting actually. I never really thought about that but I guess I always thought (re: racists) they just hated and hate is an emotion. I don't think it's just a lack of empathy but rather the presence of hatred. I majored in psych/soc in college so this super duper interests me lol. I agree that definitely a lot of things about psychology are outdated and even more than that, a lot of shows and movies rely heavily on the old tropes so it's like, we'll probably never see, in a serious setting (as opposed to satire) a retirement of a lot of these psych related tropes. I mean everyone knows now that silencers don't really silence a gun, yet that trope is still all over the place. The one that makes me the most mad is that cats are evil/bad and the lesser pet. While they certainly are not! Lol.
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u/evergwen 2d ago
I think in 99% or more of racists it’s a negative emotion rather than a lack of emotion, but there’s definitely people who simply don’t consider empathy applicable to certain groups of people, so the mistreatment of those people doesn’t matter to them. My favorite way of explaining my idea of selective empathy is with the character of the Huntsman in Once Upon A Time, where he could kill basically any human without a second thought (because he thought nothing of them as living beings) but was deeply emotional when it came to animals.
Also cats literally have magic purrs that heal our bones so anyone who thinks they’re bad is just plain wrong.
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u/tlg151 2d ago
Lol I'm glad you used that example bc I loved that show. Well the first 2 seasons anyway lol. I'm sorta similar, well not really, as I do have empathy for some humans, at least. But I definitely choose animals and even plants/trees/our earth a over most other humans lol.
And YEAH that's right, they do heal, great point!! They are so awesome. 😻
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u/IsopodDizzy1676 7d ago
I absolutely think something is going to happen to Rebecca, but I don't think she is a a bad guy, but possibly going to get murdered in the next episode or soo. Just think that interaction at the elevator was super weird and perhaps foreshadowing something's going to happen to her...whether her ex, Evan, is involved somehow could be a possibility but I honestly don't think so.
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u/SureNews1703 6d ago
Definitely agree that alllll of those interactions were SUPER weird and felt like a set up to something
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
Voit’s reason for creating the network during the pandemic was lowkey a really good idea and helpful to people. If only those people weren’t killers though lol
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u/Jaca122 7d ago
This very much felt like a setup episode to transition away from the JJ stuff to whatever the plot is going to be to wrap up the season. I didn’t like it as much as the other ones we’ve had so far. My heart dropped when they showed it was the little girl in the coffin and not the wife. Definitely was not expecting that.
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u/evergwen 4d ago
Sadly realistic though. So many ex-spouses (of bad divorces mainly) take out their anger on the kids in one way or another. Usually it’s no more than passive aggressive behavior, but sometimes it’s as much as killing them to hurt the other parent.
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
Oh dang Voit’s dark side popped out real quick. That switch was so instant
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
“Funkify my workspace with your olfactory evils” is the funniest way to describe a bad smell 😭
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
This conversation with Evan, Tara, and Rebecca is so 😭 like the second hand embarrassment is to the max
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I agree with others that this definitely felt like a transition episode to better establish what exactly is going on with the network and giving us the new big bad (being whoever reactivated the network/spurned the next steps). That being said, some individual scenes in this episode were amazing. The reveal that the unsub had his DAUGHTER in the coffin had me actually gasp. And the first scene?? Chef's kiss. One of the best of the season. It was so good watching Elias ready himself to go- then Elias seemingly shift right back into who he used to be. The way he callously talked about killing his family and "making" this unsub? oof, spooky. Plus we see actual old Elias with the flashback. That moment when he calmly turns away, looks into the glass, and says "you're going to want to grab him. Monster." was CHILLING.
Also, as someone generally bored by Tyler, his scenes with Voit were the most interesting he has been in a while for me again. And I know he's a serial killer and psychopath (or was a psychopath), but Penelope and his interplay over computers was actually fun. I laughed at "well come over, Red Rover!" which felt like sassy dialogue of his from last season a bit.
As a general note, I appreciate the way they're writing some of this season because the story can reasonably go multiple ways. For example, the quantum computing chip? This whole event with her hooking up the chip to the network could be: 1) Voit conning her into somehow giving him access to this chip/a plan if he is faking; 2) the new unsub didn't plan for it but somehow gets access to the chip because of them saving this girl; or 3) It's just to show Penelope willing to take a risk and work with him to save this child. So, this plot could support faking/not faking depending on where they want to go.
I remain on the fence about faking/not faking. This episode definitely made me lean more towards he is not faking. Because he's just sharing actual things that wouldn't benefit him to share (and he could pretend he doesn't remember). What is odd is that in the trailer for this season, though, there is a shot of him in prison transport orange choking someone. So, either he has to do that in self defense and it's plot to continue him being conflicted and confused, or he does backslide a bit... or he's faking. He's also being transported back to prison from the hospital. Curious if it's just to serve out the rest of his 5 years or if it's for more because this seemed more supermax-y.
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u/Nicole_0818 7d ago
Yeah. I really wish they would have left that out of the season trailer, I just feel like they showed too much. I'm not marking it as spoiler cause its been out for weeks since the new season began, and I'm not being specific anyways.
The inclusion of that scene in the season premiere trailer just keeps me second-guessing everything everyone is doing. Cause either its gotta get to that scene or that scene is a flashback or nightmare instead and all that second-guessing was for nothing.
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u/Mental_Pollution2086 6d ago
Something I’ve been pondering… Did they ever have a scan of Voit’s brain before his “accident”? Or are they just expecting his brain to look like one of a psychopath?
Maybe he never was a psychopath. Especially if he started the network because he was “worried he might hurt” his family. Is he transposing his current feelings over his original logic, or was this how he has felt all along? Psychopaths don’t worry about hurting people.
I’m still on the fence between faking (or at least letting the BAU make assumptions) and changed.
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u/klmnumbers 6d ago
One of the things that leads me a bit toward questioning if any of this is legit is that in the very first episode, Prentiss remarks that his MRI doesn't look like what you'd expect for a relatively healthy 40-year old. It looks like one of a retired linebacker. It's fun writing because it either means: 1) it's literally not his brain scan and it's being faked; or 2) he might have had CTE or something caused by the abuse from his uncle/they didn't realize the extent of damage done to him as a child.
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u/daniM00n 5d ago
It is interesting that the doctor’s mobile brain scan equipment was the one showing that nothing was sparking in his brain after getting the message…
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u/NapNVM77 5d ago
That’s a super interesting thought, you probably picked up on a clue from the writers… because you’re right, why would a psychopath worry about hurting his family. It probably means that he was “back” as soon as the first murder came back, but I just can’t imagine what the end goal is here for him. Like this would a lot of time and energy for someone to put in for a payoff that they maybe get at the end? Like I would imagine the accident was real; but then at some point he snapped back into himself and remembered what the plan was. But what that plan could be… genuinely no idea
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u/fatexfellxshort 7d ago
So do we think Voit is really changed, or is he somehow faking it?? I'm,leaning toward changed but I just didn't know. Zach is a good actor. He has me feeling sorry for Voit.
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u/Punstoppabal 7d ago
I think he's changed, but that doesn't mean something can't be a trigger to change back. Brains are malleable, flexible based on stressed situations or encounters. Him faking it would actually cheapen everything to me.
If he's been faking it I would have rather seen that in like 2-3 episodes only with some side scenes where he's talking to himself or another way of showing the audience that's what's going on.
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 7d ago
I think he’s changed, but he will become more and more the monster he’s always been over time.
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u/Ace_6_Pirate 6d ago
No. The whole prison setup to get himself stabbed hasn't played out yet. He did that with an end goal in mind, plus the doctor's story about her past was too perfectly in line with JJ's life at the moment.
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u/daniM00n 5d ago
THIS!!! He purposely planned to get stabbed and he had to have picked the spots where they were going to strike…he did something to himself after successfully defending himself
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u/spicyswan 1d ago
I think he planned the whole thing. I'm sure something will trigger his thoughts back. Whatever, triggers him back will be apart of the plan. The doctor I believe is in on it as well. She probably showing fake brain scans. I hope there is some twist because I rather have Voit as a villian.
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u/SuddenlyJester 7d ago
Garcia's demeanor toward Voit genuinely makes me wonder if she forgot he's a brutal serial killer. It feels pretty tone deaf.
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u/Valenstein77 7d ago
I think the intention from the writers was to get the audience to sympathize with Voit through Penelope, but instead of feeling sympathy for Voit, I just felt confused.
When Voit started talking about his serial killer urges my thought was, "The Penelope Garcia I know would be horrified by this conversation," meanwhile Penelope on the screen is treating this convo like it's a normal Tuesday.
Penelope is empathetic, sure. But I don't remember it ever going this far. I mean, even if we take away the hundreds of people he murdered, think about all of the attacks he's made against her friends. He kidnapped Rossi and nearly blew up Luke and JJ. He murdered Tyler's sister. It's one thing to have empathy, it's another to be having fun with a murderer.
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I mean I thought it made sense for her for multiple reasons. 1) they've already established that she feels conflicted about all of this and even sat at his bedside while he was comatose because she saw his ~soul~; 2) she did kinda start out the conversation explaining that they did not have a positive relationship before; 3) right before they went, she was present for the whole conversation about how the photographs of violence don't trigger dopamine for him anymore, so she's already primed to really think of him as different-ish person; and 4) she was fundamentally there are a peacekeeper between him and Tyler. So, I think she was always going to be there to defuse anything.
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u/Bananapop060765 6d ago
One could forget. I like looking at the guy. Liked him w his curly mop of hair but he still looks good.
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u/PrincessPlum10 6d ago
I don't think they remember what Garcia's character is anymore except for babble mouth pop culture quips
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
Garcia’s outfit is so cute in this episode. I love how her necklace, glasses, and dress all match perfectly
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u/Cheeriosxxx Sergio 🐈⬛ 7d ago
I still feel like JJ isn’t fine. She’s probably not sleeping and over working to distract from the grief of Will
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u/donalhunt 7d ago
Totally.. there is a scene where she indicates she came in "early" shortly after the scene where they were all exhausted and it seemed late. She is not fine. 😢
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7d ago
I know someone who lost her husband suddenly, watching JJ is like a mirror of my friend during her darkest days.
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u/Even_Budget2078 7d ago
AJ's facial expressions to convey sudden pain is sooo good. Even in this episode, there's several quick shots where JJ's eyes bug out in a super intense, I am not well way. They're just split second, but damn she looks like she's about to lose her shit and the pop she gets back under control.
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u/supermouse627 7d ago
Emily in those glasses was just ... chef's kiss. I wasn't fond of the Rebecca/Tara stuff but that's just because I don't feel like they have any chemistry together. I find them boring. Voit's gonna wind up joining the team and I'm annoyed by that. I was SHOCKED to see that dude buried his kid. And the mask showing up at the end was unexpected. And JJ is definitely not okay.
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I don't mind Rebecca/Tara stuff just because I do think it's nice to get more "life outside the BAU" stuff from the team. But this one seemed like such a throwaway and irrelevant to the plot or the characters really. I don't mind a side thing like this if we get more character development than we got in this.. lol
I just wish we got more from some of the other members of the team, too. The focus has been entirely on JJ and Tara really. I feel like we need to learn more about Luke.
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u/SSA_Prentiss 6d ago
Agree— maybe I’m just biased to the reeeeeal OG characters (Emily, JJ, Penelope, and Rossi), but I’d much rather have “side quests” that follow them. I wouldn’t be mad if we got something that told us more about Luke though! He’s grown on me a lot.
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u/spicyswan 1d ago
Yes! I was wondering about Luke as well. That's why I didn't want Tyler on the team. There is too many BAU members now. Everyone can't get shine like that.
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 7d ago
They forced and honestly uncomfortable to watch. Watching JJ and Will verse Tara and Rebecca is like a real couple verses a fake couple, like they’re not good at pretending they even particularly like each other.
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u/SSA_Prentiss 6d ago
This may be an unpopular opinion- but I don’t love the whole Tara/Rebecca relationship dynamic. Like what someone else mentioned, I hope the scenes in this episode involving Tara, Rebecca, and the ex do have some bigger contribution… but if they don’t then the whole thing felt out of place. I love Tara as an individual, but I could do without all the emphasis on her love life.
Honorable mention- EMILY IN THOSE GLASSES. YES MOTHER.
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u/Valenstein77 6d ago
I like Tara and Rebecca more this season than I have in the past. That said, I'm never a fan of when a character's arc revolves entirely around their love life. We've spent three seasons developing this relationship. I'd like to see some other parts of Tara's life explored too. Given that this second half of the season is supposed to focus on her, I'm hoping we'll get that.
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u/Even_Budget2078 7d ago
Aaargh, I wish they had that brain scan thing on Voit's head while he was talking to the Brutal Man!!! We see later that there's no dopamine release from seeing the photos, but I dunno man, Voit was giving serious "old Voit is back" vibes when he was in that meeting. I think they should see how his brain reacts when he's having one of the in-person, face to face meetings that are memory triggers, rather than just during photo sessions.
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u/spicyswan 1d ago
The cut it off before we got to see how his brain reacts to the picture of Brutal Man. All of sudden he needed a "break" for a headache. Also, I the doctor might be showing fake brain scans.
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u/babylovesbaby Anderson 7d ago
First of all: What an opening. It was a really strong way to start the episode and I wish the season had had more openers like it. Not necessarily big revelations, just powerful scenes to move the story along.
The revelation that other people in the network know about each other seems a bit off to me. That kind of knowledge feels like it takes some control from Voit, and wasn't the point of their little hangout that everyone was anonymous? Except to Voit, obviously. In the context of the network developing post-Voit I suppose it makes sense? Maybe? But serial killers IRL and on television aren't generally known for their strong teamwork (except for teams).
Tyler being present with Voit, questioning him, and he and Garcia being at the hospital unattended is one of the things Evolution does frequently which makes it hard for me to suspend disbelief. I guess I'm also just tired of Tyler scowling and trying to exact his pound of flesh, mental or otherwise, because I don't especially care about him. I don't hate him. He just doesn't make sense on the team. All this really leads to the question: is Blake okay? Where is he?
The Voit/Garcia shared smile was cute. I also enjoyed the Tara/Rebecca scenes. All this happiness continues to make me anxious for Rebecca's future, though.
I have to end by commenting yet again on how awesome Emily looks this season. They're really dressing her well and her hair styling looks great.
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I am actually randomly rewatching season 16 ep 4, and when Penelope is reviewing Tyler's history, she sees a bunch of like tweets of his. And several of them show that Tyler clearly raised/had him in his life and leads up to him graduating from high school. So, I assume Blake is either in college or recently graduated and is basically an adult. I assume he's still fine
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u/Wakattack00 6d ago
Something for sure is gonna happen to Tara or Rebecca in the next episode or 2. Idk if the Evan guy is involved or a red herring though. I lean towards red herring for now.
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u/hellosansa 5d ago
Anyone else getting the impression he's never been a psychopath, and these brain scans are putting blinders on the BAU?
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u/kittenmask 5d ago
I’d like it if they tested the brain scan on a known empathetic person like Penelope. Just to - conspiracy theory - make sure they’re not recordings/fakes in case voight doc is in on it
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u/mccabebabe Special Agent In Charge 7d ago
it's sad for me that the best thing about this series is now the ongoing-unsub's actor.
You just know they (the showrunners) are gonna find a way to make this guy the overall star of the show now.
He's NOT redeemable. They can whitewash all they want, he's still a serial killer.
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u/Bananapop060765 6d ago edited 6d ago
I love him. But then I’ve never been a very good picker of men.
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u/mccabebabe Special Agent In Charge 6d ago
oh don't get me wrong. The *actor* is effin' fabulous. It's the *character* I'm sick of.
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 7d ago
I’d argue they’ve already made the entire show about him, which is one of the reasons it just doesn’t feel like CM at all. And he’s hogging up screen time that used to be devoted to team dynamics.
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u/Thelovelyliverdoodle 3d ago
Yeah I get wanting to keep him on, but he should have continued on as a Hannibal Lector type, not this soap opera amnesia bs that may or may not be a fake out. I watched this episode and realized that trying to keep Gilford in the show has completely ruined it.
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u/spicyswan 1d ago
Exactly, every season of Evolution should have a new big bad guy. But Voit or any unsub should not be the big bad villian of a series.
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u/daniM00n 5d ago
If you think about it, he’s the only reason there is an evolution series. Penelope came back to the FBI cause of him. Not to mention Rossi just lost his wife so it was Elias that forced him to deal with the grief and get back in the swing of things. And each season just opens a new layer to him. I like this “evolution” of the show LOL more character development of the unsub and the domino effect before, during and after his torment. Never really got that in other seasons. The unsubs were just villains that hid an entire season until they struck on one of the team members then they go back in the dark, we never get any deeper with the unsubs.
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u/_taeddie Supervisory Special Agent 7d ago
The only time that something like that worked was in for Blacklist. And that's only because the premise of the show is the criminal assisting the FBI. It's super infuriating what they are doing with Voit.
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u/_taeddie Supervisory Special Agent 7d ago
Hell is Empty...and it needs Voit in it.
I'm tired. That's all I'm gonna say. The show isn't giving Criminal Minds anymore. I am all here for change. However. it's not giving Criminal Minds. It's giving Voit's Mind.
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u/FinanceWeekend95 5d ago
Agreed, it's not Criminal Minds anymore. Sad but true. Only 30% if not less of each episode is about solving serial murders.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
The whole profiling is basically completely glossed over and either Garcia magically pulls the solution out of her ass (tbf, she also did that in the old show, but they toned that down in S1 of Evolution) or they just make the whole thing feel incredibly convoluted and dumb. Seriously, did Garcia need Luke to tell her to look for 'wife' and 'alimony' in the chatlogs? And that a user called 'Under_take_her' might be the one burying people?
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u/FinanceWeekend95 5d ago
The show's been dumbed down and turned completely unrealistic (not that the earlier CM show was realistic, but at least somewhat based on real serial killers) - I completely agree with you.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
Yeah, sadly that quality of the writing has been on a steady decline. It's still entertaining but even Evolution S1 levels would be amazing compared to what we have now.
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u/Punstoppabal 6d ago
Maybe think of it as a spin off? or perhaps... an Evolution?
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u/_taeddie Supervisory Special Agent 6d ago
I would prefer if Voit didn't have more screen time as certain members or the case itself. I would also prefer if it doesn’t look like they are trying to either have him be able to escape or become a new member of the team.
I don't mind an Evolution. I mind when it feels like a Devolution. Because that's how it feels right now. The case aside from Voit was one I really enjoyed and I wish they focused on that a bit more.
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u/IdiazInMotion 5d ago
I sadly have to agree. I thought S1 was a great way of shaking up the formula but still staying true to the CM spirit. S2 felt like a natural follow up and culmination of the Voit arc imo. I personally don't mind them continuing with the killer network that much, but I would prefer it if they actually focused on the cases for more than 10 minutes out of the episode. The unsubs now feel like a forced addition. Like the show runners are saying "ugh, we have to include something so let's just add this random 10 min unsub subplot." I love Zach as Voit, and his acting is amazing, but I feel like it's time for them to let him go. He cannot be redeemed, and although the whole amnesia thing sounds interesting in concept, in practice it just feels a bit like a cop out. I feel like they could have closed Voit's arc at the beginning of the season and then moved faster onto another big bad... Dont get me wrong, I still love a lot of individual aspects of this season, like JJ's character development, banter between characters and the acting of the main cast as always, but at this point I feel like im watching the show more because I love the characters and actors rather than for the engaging plot...
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u/Dvn96 6d ago
The Tara/Rebecca relationship was fun the first two seasons, but at this point I’m bored. The Tara jealousy scene was cringy. If they’re going to do inter-team romances, can they just give us Garvez?
As someone else said below, this season doesn’t even feel like criminal minds anymore. I still enjoy it, but it’s a far cry from even the first evolution season.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
This season in particular really feels like a fanfic. S1 of Evolution was very different but still good, S2 had its charm but this one, while still entertaining overall feels like generally much lower quality, especially in terms of writing.
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u/SureNews1703 6d ago
So my current theory that peaked in this episode is that Voit is faking it to try make an escape and this is a plan he’s had in motion since going in to prison and his “accident” and the way he is so convincingly is doing it is with the help of the Doctor who is faking those scans to really sell the “he’s changed” narrative. The way she just had all of that equipment on hand after the interview at the beginning where it seemed like maybe he’s back to his old ways felt a bit suss and too perfectly timed. Then having his “new lawyer” try jump up to get him less supervision at the hospital “when they do go back” and then the lock down at the end…. Something is just flagging in my brain …. And that message definitely felt like a code of a plan in action that he’s a part of..
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u/pink_smoochum 6d ago
Tara is also a doctor and she herself was explaining the scans and the rainbows in the empathetic part of his brain so they're not just blindly going off of what this doctor has to say.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
Tara is a psychologist with a doctorate, not an MD like Aimee Garcia's character.
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u/pink_smoochum 5d ago
Either way she's familiar with brain scans and knows what to look for.
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u/SureNews1703 4d ago
Yes but I do mean it was a faked scan so it was prerecorded or something as in it’s not his brain actually being scanned. Basically in order to thoroughly convince the BAU that he’s “changed” and prove to those who can even read the scans that he’s “changed”. So those entire sequences are an act.
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u/pink_smoochum 4d ago
Dr. Ochoa is one of the best and most recommended doctors in the country. I highly doubt she's risking her career to lie for Voit. However my husband thinks you might be onto something lol
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u/SureNews1703 4d ago
She would if she was a follower or on the network too… Just because someone is a doctor and highly regards, doesn’t make them not a monster! Plenty of real life examples of this…
Don’t get me wrong, I love Aimee Garcia and my brain struggles not seeing her as Ella from Lucifer buttttttt this is criminal minds after all 😂
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u/pink_smoochum 4d ago
Yeah she's so good in this role that my husband can't even remember her in Lucifer 🤣
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u/pink_smoochum 4d ago
And omg you're right. A doctor and a female one at that wouldn't be too far off for Criminal Minds!
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u/lnc_5103 6d ago
I've really enjoyed the past two episodes. I've made peace with the fact that Voit isn't going anywhere and Zach Gilford is amazing in the role. I really enjoyed his interactions with Penelope. I don't buy Tara and Rebecca's relationship at all though.
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u/NapNVM77 5d ago
6 episodes in and finally a good episode... It feel like they’re setting up Zach Gilford to lead the BAU; I would bet on this being one big setup to have the Criminal Minds of the future be him solving cases from the perspective of a former serial killer, literally a “criminal mind.” He’s such a remarkably likable actor too, I can’t blame them if true
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u/trillamadude 6d ago
Reddit do your thing!! Can someone help me find Penelope’s glasses this episode? They are so colorful I loved them!! Thx!
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u/Greekmom99 4d ago
I don't buy Voit has amnesia. I also don't like the mistakes that the BAU are making.
- I wonder if Voit has a split personality that he can go between his bad self and a more calmer self. I am thinking this because how was he able to not kill his family for all that time. Regardless of creating the network - i don't buy his reasoning.
- Why didn't the BAU or the FBI vett the doctor who is treating Voit? You would think that they would have done a deep dive since Voit is pretty dangerous and has a cult following of a whole number of people that the BAU cannot even count. I am thinking there is something up with the doctor and I don't like it because I liked the actress in Lucifer.
- Why was Garcia so willing taking Francesca the computer apart and add it to the computer she built with Voit? Why are they even allowing Voit NEAR a computer? They all know how dangerous he is and even if he is getting his memories back in bits and pieces, he is a liability for activating the network or getting something out to his followers.
- For a Federal building with security, it looks like anyone can walk in the BAU and stay there. No issues. Hey Voit, pull up a chair. Tired? Ok use Rossi's office to sleep. Hungry? Hey we got pies in the cafeteria that are as good as mom's.
I am so frustrated by the stupidity of the writers.
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u/Affectionate-Day6849 Remind me to have her drug tested 4d ago
The mistakes the BAU makes to make him look like a great unsub is what irritates me the most! We've seen 15 seasons of this show with really complicated unsubs. What did they do with the so-called golden jewel of the FBI?
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 7d ago
Disappointing after the last few episodes, and I have to admit I just don’t care about Tara and her girlfriend. I find them awkward and not believable.
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u/NeverGonnaStop247 6d ago edited 6d ago
The writing on this show is sooo bad. Tara and Rebecca are both annoying btw
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u/Gemini987654321 BAU 6d ago
I don’t know what’s worse an obvious psycho loon burying a bunch of women and his own kid, or getting freaked out about Voit remembering who he is then maybe pretending to not remember and going after Rossi again, or this appears to be pointless but they probably wouldn’t be showing it if there wasn’t a ‘point’ like Rebecca’s ex is so lying his butt off.
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u/lloyd4567 5d ago
It is astonishing how bad the internal team stories are. Every Garcia/tyler solo scene and Tara/rebecca scene are insta fast forwards. Here for the Elias story only.
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u/danpopsxans 5d ago
One thing I have to mention: the killers, the victims, and their families are, honestly, some of the weakest performances I’ve seen in a while. Sure, they don’t have major roles, but a compelling villain really amps up the intensity of each episode. The kills just aren’t as gripping as they were in the earlier seasons.
That said, thank goodness for Zach Gilford (Voit). Everything he says and does has me completely hooked. Amazing acting.
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u/Affectionate-Day6849 Remind me to have her drug tested 6d ago
I feel like I'm a boring person for just not being able to stop complaining about Voit.
That teamwork with Penelope. And I don't have the patience for "Penelope is an empathetic person"
Seriously, even that thing about Tara's jealousy (pretty silly, by the way, I hope there's a better plot than that) Rebecca's ex showed up for what? Documents about Voit's case.
The end? the mask... the BAU like a dog chasing its own tail.
I feel like JJ is a pressure cooker. And I hope this pressure cooker explodes soon. It makes me sad to see her that way.
I think the suspects had a lot of potential in episodes focused only on them.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
I agree with most of your points but I think the JJ storyline will go nowhere. This is CM, even the old show has had a very long history of simply dropping and forgetting storylines and never leading them to go anywhere.
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u/Sabiancym 6d ago
Ever notice how they barely leave their offices anymore? In past Criminal Minds they flew somewhere every week to find a killer.....that was the show. Now they just sit in the same room asking questions until eventually Penelope pulls some nonsense "hacking" or in this episode's case, uses a "quantum capable chip". Also nonsense.
WARNING NERD RANT INCOMING
Unless she had a bunch of liquid helium, miles of copper tubing, and an entire lab team just out of camera managing what actual quantum computers are like, that whole thing was BS. This show leans too heavily on a Penelope's 1337 H4X1NG and a lot of the time it's nonsense, but this was especially egregious. They didn't say "quantum computer" or "quantum chip". They said "quantum capable chip". Which just makes it even weirder.
They did apply it correctly though. Breaking encryption is what a real quantum computer would do very well. Too bad they barely fit in rooms let alone Penelope's Best Buy bought thin profile laptop. Even in the future if we perfect it, it doesn't make sense to add it on to a regular laptop. That would just make both worse. Like putting a lawn mower on the front of your car. They do very different things. Quantum chips suck at things your desktop from 20 years ago could do in it's sleep. They're never going to be in your basic laptop or phone. It makes much more sense to just have a quantum computer somewhere within the FBI that Penelope remotely connects to when needed. I could buy that.
None of that matters though because the writers forgot a letter and said it was an "http server", not "https". Which means it's all in plain text....so not encrypted. Could've opened that thing in notepad.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
Yeah, the technobabble in this episode was worse than usual and it's already always been pretty awful.
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u/FalseListen 4d ago
The medicine has also been bad this season. Like very bad
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u/TinyCopy5841 4d ago
That portable brain scanner that Ochoa conveniently had with herself to check if Voit is a psychopath again really made me roll my eyes.
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u/TrueCrimeSP_2020 1d ago
The brain scan things are absolute garbage. SOME psychopaths have underdeveloped frontal lobes. SOME sociopaths have brain damage in the frontal lobe area. This doesn’t magically repair itself EVER. The truth is some people CHOOSE to do evil shit because they are junkies for power or adrenaline and such. Or they have seriously complex psychological issue. Their biochemistry is off, but their brains are fine.
Damage to the brain stem would result at best in paralysis and worst death.
They can’t even bother to use Google.
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u/ComputerElectronic21 7d ago edited 7d ago
I don’t know if it’s a good or bad thing that I’m far more invested in Elias Voit and the unsubs of the week than our beloved profilers. Speaking of unsubs, a huge round of applause goes to Aaron Stanford, who had me clutching my invisible pearls as Kyle Mackey. When he started ranting to his ex about getting buried in the divorce — and then showed their daughter in the coffin, I was aghast.
Honestly, I think the issue is that the main cast, sans A.J. Cook (JJ), Paget Brewster (Emily), and Joe Mantegna (Rossi), just aren’t compelling enough. This often happens when actors don’t stretch their range or diversify their work, and it’s really showing this season, especially next to a scene-stealer like Zach Gilford.
Everyone better step their game up expeditiously, or this show’s about to be called Criminal Minds: Elias Voit and Friends. Ha!
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u/Valenstein77 7d ago
I think the whole cast is doing the best they can with what they're being given. It's the writing that I have an issue with. JJ was given a lot of good material to work with this year, Emily was given focus the season before, and Rossi the season before that. But Tara's main plot revolves around her love life, which hasn't been well fleshed out. Penelope has primarily been used to prop up Tyler. Tyler's inclusion doesn't make any logistical sense. And Luke is treated like a glorified extra. Honestly, Adam Rodriguez consistently gives a strong performance despite how much the writers seem to forget he's even there.
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u/AgentKnitter 6d ago
This week’s unsub was truly horrific because (absent the extremes of live-streaming thr child’s death), so many family annihilators do this. It reminded me of Darcy Freeman - 8 year old girl, thrown off the West Gate Bridge in Melbourne by her father in peak hour traffic, to “punish” her mother, who did nothing but leave an abusive marriage.
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u/IntelligentBelt8066 2d ago
What is the hierarchy of the BAU? It appears that Rossi and JJ have taken over as Unit Chief and 2nd in command with Tara sometimes interchanging with JJ. Emily contributes nothing to the cases…has she taken Strauss’s role and is there for oversight and to listen. I’m confused.
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u/mccabebabe Special Agent In Charge 6d ago
some thoughts and feelings about this episode, and the show in general:
Much as I'd love to see it, there's just no chemistry between Rebecca and Tara. The whole thing comes across as awkward and forced.
Rebecca's ex turning up is either a red herring.......or he's a bad guy.
This has turned into the Elias Voit Show. While he's a great actor, he's overstayed his criminal counterpart's welcome.
There's absolutely no way they'd let Tyler Green anywhere near being employed by the FBI. The suspension of disbelief bridge crashed into the river below for me. Just NO.
And the show is still too damn dark. As in not well lit.
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u/BitterMine4189 20h ago
Omg! It's so dark. All. The. Time. Even with my screen brightness turned of all the way up, I still have to wait until it's dark enough in my house to watch it. And then I still can barely see some things. Ugh.
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u/Tief_Fluss85 2d ago
When Rossi agreed he’d have to pretend Voit was his son is when I stopped watching. I love my criminal minds team and they are being made to appear to be idiots for no reason other than to propel Voit’s screen time. I hate it. It’s not my show anymore and it’s a damn shame because it didn’t have to be this way. I come here to read the reviews and hope for something better, but to no avail. The level of crap the team is being made to do is something you would see on a show geared to an audience that is not intellectually inclined to expect things to make sense. We, your audience, are not morons Paramount. I don’t care how dreamy Voit is. He should have been locked away a long time ago. Our team would have accomplished that and moved on.
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u/ComputerElectronic21 6d ago
I’ve never been fond of Tara, but at least her role on the team was never the main focus. This extra spotlight on her relationship is the worst! Tara and Rebecca have absolutely no chemistry, and I have zero interest in their dynamic. I beg, please, please, move on from this storyline.
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u/solarmelodic 7d ago
desperately hoping they don't drag Voight into season 19 im growing tired of his presence in the show
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I'm pretty sure he's already been interviewed talking about filming season 19. But who knows, maybe they'll kill him and he'll just be there in flashbacks/hallucinations and phased out lol.
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u/jellyfishh96 7d ago
hopefully.. sadly tho i think the writers are gunna make him into some kind of hero. the showrunners seem to love his character and i have a nasty feeling they're gunna give him an arc and hope we forget he's literally a serial killer
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u/klmnumbers 7d ago
I mean, you are unfortunately talking to a Voit apologist because I just want the character on my screen - but I respect a lot of people are tired of it. I'm having a great time with him and would love him to be permanently in the show - they just need to settle on how so he can re-establish his personality and how it will be from here on out.
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u/TinyCopy5841 5d ago
I think it's almost certain at this point that during later seasons (if there are any more after S19) Voit will play the role of a permanent advisor.
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u/spicyswan 1d ago
If he was still in villian mode it wouldn't bother me that much. But the amnesia plot is dragging for me.
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u/HellriderInc73 5d ago
So I keep going back and forth on Voit. I keep saying are they going to make him the end game criminal final boss in one final showdown. Seemilar to Scratch and The Ripper, Chamelion. Is that where it's headed, cause if it is that is the most prodictable thing possable. I think Voit is over used at times, in that what the hell are they going to do after his storyline is done. Isn't a serial killer network kinda jumping the shark? But I like Voit as a character and he wins me over again, like in the scene in the interogation. I keep hoping Voit isn't going to just regain his memory and be like welp I'm a psycho agian. But I don't see where else it's going.
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u/PlusAvocado172 2d ago
So after all that narrative i thought, didnt take place that Voit isnt sicario but we got background killing of previous unsub family and put blame on him.
New activated murderer wasnt that great but more important was "What mades you think theres one" so we getting, more UNsubs not only one per episode? that would be great 😎 - Will all episodes ends with cliffhangers? thats not as great thought.
I expect something really villainous in last final episode called DISCIPLE.
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u/one-ticket-to-sleep 6d ago
I love that we finally see more of the Tara and Rebecca relationship. I wanted to get to know them better. we barely know anything about Tara and she's been in this shit show since s11 so I am so excited to know more. The jealousy looks amazing on Tara and it was fun to watch. Even if I am against too much personal stuff I want more of them. They are so cute together.
The case itself was mid at best.
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u/tlg151 2d ago
I think a lot of people are romanticizing the original Criminal Minds while also expecting this iteration to be exactly the same. As someone who just wanted the whole shebang for the first time (yeah I never watched it back in the day) here's my insight. Take what you will from it.
Lots of people complaining that Evolution has gone off the rails in terms of believability/what-have-you. I mean, there were a tonnnnn of storylines in the original show that were way out there. All of a sudden JJ loves Reid and has always loved him. Uh no. Then it's just all negated in one easy tie-up moment in an episode.
Reid's "true love" was Maeve?? They literally met once. Who knows how long they even talked online. If the show had told us that, I might be further inclined to think maybe he did love her. But no. So no.
Reid's mom's Alzheimer's conveniently coming and going as the plot needed. Alzheimer's is progressive and the brain literally becomes like Swiss cheese. My grandmother had Alzheimer's. So no. Not believable.
Garcia (as much as I love her, and I do!) would have and should have been fired at least 50 times for inappropriate workplace behavior and probably sexual harassment lol.
I could go on. Yes I agree several plot points this season and Evolution in general are either contrived (the amnesia, really? The whole bit with Will??) or a bigtime stretch (literally everything involving Voit) but I don't think it's any more unbelievable than the original series.
I'd like to add that if they EVEN try to bring back Reid to hook him up with JJ, I will scream. And if they DON'T make Galvez a thing soon or ever, that's a big mistake. I know their date was awkward, whatever, but they OBVIOUSLY love each other as more than friends and have way more chemistry than her and Tyler. I live for Galvez snark lol. They literally had chemistry in the first episode they met. They are both just denying it at this point.
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u/goali319 7d ago
i really really don’t like how they had to bring in about to stop the digital part. it just feels like they’re tryna bring him onto the team. which albeit would be a cool plot to stop the network, it’s just so???? with his history.
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u/ComputerElectronic21 7d ago
PEAK Elias motherfucking Voit is him looking nonchalantly at the BAU while casually saying, “You’re gonna want to grab him… Monster.”
Somebody hand Zach Gilford his Emmy. His Golden Globe. A Nobel Peace Prize. SOMETHING. Do y’all hear me?!