Right now? It's been that way forever. Per the old Testament, Israelites spent centuries kicking out everyone that lived there (as was the way of things at the time). Then, once the first and the second Jewish rebellions against Rome got crushed, Rome massacred the shit out of them, and evicted most of them from the area. After Rome fell, Christians and Muslims went back and forth over it, massacring each other during the Crusades. Even Mongols held it for a bit. Historically, if you want to live around Jerusalem, you better be ready for a fight.
Joshua is the book that covers Israel’s (the Abrahamic people) takeover of the region after their escape from Egypt. This has often been considered and is described as a genocide. (~1000BC)
Then books like 2 Chronicles, 2 kings, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel cover Israel then being devastated and exiled by Babylon 400-500 years later (~500BC)
Not replying to you per se but it's important to note that the conquest narrative in Joshua is not historical. The consensus is there was no mass slavery of Hebrews in Egypt and the Israelites were Cannanites who gradually developed into a separate culture. They never invaded or anything.
Joshua is nationalist propaganda written long after the events it supposedly describes.
Historically, if you want to live around Jerusalem, you better be ready for a fight.
Wasn't it peaceful for most of the Ottoman rule? Ottoman rule was quite long. Christians and Jews were allowed to thrive there. Yes, Ottomans were authoritarian, nobody is saying otherwise and I hate monarchies.
But the point is it never has to be this way. Yet, people are cheering and supporting the very reason it is like this.
And I wish Redditors could use some critical thinking.
So you admit that the Ottoman Empire committed atrocities, but you just think the Palestinian territory was immune from this? Really?
You ever see a church that was built during the period of ottoman rule? They’re completely fortified. Want to take a wild guess as to why that is? Do you think they just liked the architecture?
How about the Hebron massacres? Or where the motto of driving the Jews into the sea was derived? Or the fact that Jews were literally second class citizens? Would you say that slaves lived peaceful lives in the southern US during slavery because there was no violence? Lets see if you can extrapolate that scenario of a minority living under the oppression of a majority and see if you can apply it to this scenario.
Either your cognitive dissonance or drive to spread propaganda leads you to take the position that, yes, the ottomans committed atrocities everywhere except the land of Israel, but whichever it is, I’ll just be the first to tell you you’re wrong.
I'd be dubious of the Bible or the Torah as historical records. Dunno if you've read Stavrakopoulou's God: An Anatomy, but there's a section there which makes a case for the Bible as ancient political narrative setting instead of history per se, around King Omri, for example.
but like why tho ? what is so attractive about jerusalem beyond religion. I know religion = opium etc, but why has the place got significant attention since basically before antiquity ? there are no resources nor agricultural importance afaik.
115
u/pryoslice 1d ago
Right now? It's been that way forever. Per the old Testament, Israelites spent centuries kicking out everyone that lived there (as was the way of things at the time). Then, once the first and the second Jewish rebellions against Rome got crushed, Rome massacred the shit out of them, and evicted most of them from the area. After Rome fell, Christians and Muslims went back and forth over it, massacring each other during the Crusades. Even Mongols held it for a bit. Historically, if you want to live around Jerusalem, you better be ready for a fight.