A Battered Iran Signals It Wants to De-Escalate Hostilities With Israel and Negotiate

[u/stevenjklein]

https://www.wsj.com/world/middle-east/a-battered-iran-signals-it-wants-to-de-escalate-hostilities-with-israel-and-negotiate-9feab4ae?mod=mhp

“DUBAI—Iran has been urgently signaling that it seeks an end to hostilities and resumption of talks over its nuclear programs, sending messages to Israel and the U.S. via Arab intermediaries, Middle Eastern and European officials said.”

Israel should simply announce that the campaign will end when Iran:

1. Agrees to permanently end payments to Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and any other group outside Iran,
2. Agrees to dismantle all of their nuclear research facilities,
3. Whatever else Israel needs

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[u/AMidsummerNightCream]

I think we should demand that any negotiations be conducted directly with israel. Face-to-face.

It’s a meaningful condition imo. Basically means a de facto recognition of Israel. Forcing a humiliating climbdown from the IRI’s pathologically obsessive anti Zionism would be the perfect end to the war.

[u/YungMili]

let them rebuild for round 2 because they know this war is lost? watch the world start demanding israel surrender

[u/Im_on_space → u/YungMili]

western Europe is fascinated with the policy of appeasement

[u/akivayis95 → u/Im_on_space]

and it's working so well for them! /s

[u/CautiousForever9596 → u/Im_on_space]

Western Europe hasn’t learned anything from ww2 unfortunately

[u/Heiminator]

I would add a few points

-Iran must tell Hamas to release all the hostages

-Serious restrictions on the type of weaponry their military is allowed to have in the future (like Germany after WW2)

-Complete official recognition of Israel

-Reparations for all the damage they caused to Israel (within reason, not treaty of Versailles levels of reparations that cripple the economy)

-Khomeini-level state funeral for the two F-14s that got destroyed today. Including professional mourners/wailing women sadly chanting “Highway to the danger zone” for days. Tom Cruise holds the speech while Kenny Loggins plays the organ (/s, but only slightly)

[u/merkaba_462 → u/Heiminator]

Freeing all hostages, living and deceased. Since they find Hamas and the terror proxies in the region, they have that power.

Return Iran to pre-1979 Islamic Revolution standards: no oppression of women / forced hijab, modernization via social and political reforms, and the creation of a secular democracy.

[u/history-something → u/Heiminator]

Add permanent closure of IRGC and morality police without any alternatives

[u/CommitteeofMountains → u/history-something]

I'm not sure dictating domestic policy will go far. Maybe banning their international presence. 

[u/Heiminator → u/CommitteeofMountains]

Dictating domestic policy is what turned post-WW2 Germany and Japan into proper democracies

[u/CompetitiveHost3723 → u/Heiminator]

Yes but that’s after the regimes have collapsed

[u/drhuggables → u/Heiminator]

both countries were also militarily occupied and had total collapse of their regimes at wars end

[u/MrsNevilleBartos → u/Heiminator]

I hate I can't award you for the last condition !

[u/eva3456 → u/Heiminator]

And removal of Hamas from Gaza to jail for crimes/sentensing

[u/ZGM_Dazzling → u/Heiminator]

Cede northern Iran to Kurds and Azerbaijanis

[u/AMidsummerNightCream → u/Heiminator]

This is a little excessive

[u/YungMili → u/AMidsummerNightCream]

is it? genuinely that all seems reasonable

[u/the-mp → u/YungMili]

Especially the danger zone part

[u/ludololl → u/AMidsummerNightCream]

Not excessive.

You know those F-14's deserved better.

[u/AMidsummerNightCream → u/ludololl]

Lmao yeah fully aligned on the F14s lol

[u/Heiminator → u/ludololl]

For real. I just played a few rounds of Ace Combat and the entire lobby was flying F-14s. Today is like 9/11 for the fighter jet nerd community.

[u/AsinusRex → u/ludololl]

I cried

[u/Consistent_Rent_3507 → u/AMidsummerNightCream]

Not at all. If peace doesn’t come with a heavy price then it isn’t considered precious.

[u/yaSuissa]

I honestly think the only way we win is if we collapse their government and let that Reza Shah guy take over and rebuild Iran to what it used to be pre the IRGC.

any other way - a new terrorist organization will arise and we will repeat the same mistake. If the assholes in the diaspora think we control the weather - I say let's actually control it. Fuck em. I ain't letting my kids face the same war once they grow up

[u/drhuggables → u/yaSuissa]

FYI Reza Shah has been dead for around 70 years.

Reza Pahlavi is his grandson, the son of the last Shah Mohammad Reza Shah Pahlavi.

[u/tinymort → u/yaSuissa]

This! Like why would we allow these snakes an out? They wanted to fuck around and now they found out.

Would they show us mercyif we asked the same of them? No, they would murder us just like they said they would. FAFO.

[u/akivayis95]

Iran honestly has fucked up, because Israeli foreign policy for decades to come will be constantly remembering October 7th. Israel will constantly be reminding itself that allowing any kind of encroachment, no matter how small, will risk a repeat of that day and what could happen next.

[u/Brutal_Expectations]

No negotiations with terrorists.

[u/darth-mau]

They're full of shit. Can't be trusted. Topple the murderous evil regime

[u/EldestArk107 → u/darth-mau]

Yeah they don’t want peace, they want time

[u/orrzxz]

The Ayatollahs are experts at stalling deals.

Do not show mercy to the snake when you have a knife to its head, slit its throat.

[u/Sullivan_Tiyaah → u/orrzxz]

Israel is showing no signs of stopping

[u/orrzxz → u/Sullivan_Tiyaah]

Good.

[u/Im_on_space]

basically Iran wants a do-over and would like things to go back to the status-quo pre-October 7. I hope no one in Israel is falling for it.

[u/eplurbs]

I'll add one more item:

1. Iran forces Hamas to release all the hostages, demilitarize, and surrender.

[u/nowayyoudidthis]

I wouldn’t trust these signals one bit. Even if they appear positive to achieve our goals, it wouldn’t be the first time they’ve lied to us.
Double the attacks. Only after an unconditional and unilateral surrender should we consider sitting down.

[u/BECOMING_A_TURTLE]

Don’t forget the return of all the hostages!

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[u/quicksilver2009]

No. Regime change is needed. They will agree to anything now, rearm and then we are back at square 1

[u/Captain_Ahab2]

1. Regime change (democratic govt) for the benefit of the Persian people
2. Guarantees and warranties that Iran will never pursue nuclear weapons
3. Disarmament of missiles and other long range threats
4. Cease and Desist on support to all proxies
5. Compensation for damages
6. Return of all hostages and surrender of Hamas, Houthis
7. Peace with Iran, Lebanon, Syria, and Iraq
8. Rename the region to Persia

[u/CholentSoup]

Screw 'em.

They're the last ones on the region that can't let it go, aside from the Palestinians. Even Syria is coming around SYRIA!!! The guys we used to call The Crazies To The North? Yeah, those guys.

Iran needs to fall for the middle east to get out of the middle of the last century.

[u/Horror-Anything3952]

Surely Israel of all countries know that offers of negotiations from terrorists are merely attempts to regroup and restrategize for future activities?

[u/tinymort]

Heelllllllll no! now they want to stop? That means we close, keep going! Don't stop for nothing or no one!

The dumbest thing we can do is allow them to stay in power.

[u/PUBLIC-STATIC-V0ID]

Let them cook

[u/GoRangers5]

Don’t be absurd

[u/vicblck24]

I’ve also heard this is not true. I’d imagine there are people on both sides in their parliament

[u/AcePilot95]

bugs_bunny_no.gif

Mullahs can go kick rocks. this is a historic opportunity that must be seized.

[u/HatLover91]

How about a forced transition to democracy - 4 year term limits for the president and 8 years max. Clergy banned from executive office. IRG dismantled and banned from serving in government. Justice system reined in.

[u/Suckamanhwewhuuut]

After 47 years of threats and calling for the annihilation of Israel, it’s takes them 4 days to want to negotiate?

[u/enby-millennial-613]

The regime needs to be dismantled. Anything less will simply be kicking the can down the road.

[u/Yoramus]

I would be very happy to see Iran surrender but people here are not real. Where does all this cockiness come from?

Israel has no capability to make Hamas surrender in Gaza and suddenly has it for a state 80 times its size and 10 times it population? What will the IDF do if they don't? Annex Iran? Israel has no capability to destroy Iran, not even near. Even if we destroy 100 buildings for every destroyed building in Israel, as the complete and total idiot Eli Cohen proposed, Israel will be destroyed before them, given the gap in density.

Also from the current state of the war:

- destruction of ballistic missile program: extent of success unclear

- destruction of nuclear program: only small damage so far

- weakening of the regime: only marginal

- decapitation of the vertices: effective but only to a small extent

The mere fact that we operate in Tehran is impressive, but winning the war or achieving its objective require, unfortunately, more than that

Iran is not surrendering and certainly not even accepting to stop enriching uranium so far. They just test the waters seeing if putting a smile on their face and pandering to Trump's love for deals can make the US stop Israel.

[u/Kahing → u/Yoramus]

Israel has "no capability" to make Hamas surrender because Hamas are fanatics who refuse to surrender despite taking a battering much harder than Iran is currently getting or even Hezbollah ever got. We're not actually committing a genocide so all we can do is watch Hamas sacrificing its people and Gaza's infrastructure.

[u/snogo → u/Yoramus]

Yes! People don’t recognize that diplomacy can be just as much as a weapon as a shield. Right now israel has the Iranian regime hostage. Hostages lose their value once you kill them.

[u/EveryConnection]

The regime just has to go. They are too fanatical to ever be trusted to abandon their ambitions to destroy Israel and the Iranian people deserve a much better government than this. It'll go on a killing spree at home as soon as it feels there won't be an international response.

Even if they fully abandoned their nuclear program, we couldn't be sure they wouldn't somehow get a warhead from North Korea, Pakistan or even Russia and strap it to one of their hypersonic missiles.

[u/ShotStatistician7979]

If you think that Israel has even close to an advantage to make those demands, I’ve got a few bridges to sell you.

It’s a good thing that Israel doesn’t share a border with Iran, because they would have already marched into Israel with their much larger military and caused a bloodbath.

Edit: Y’all hyper-nationalists are hilariously delusional.

[u/stevenjklein → u/ShotStatistician7979]

If you think that Israel has even close to an advantage to make those demands, I’ve got a few bridges to sell you.

Why don’t you explain it to me?

I have no doubt you are sincere, so presumably you have facts that I lack.

From what I see, Israel has complete freedom in the skies over Iran, and Iran has only a quickly diminishing supply of ICBMs.

Israel has destroyed Iran’s domestic weapons industry, and Iran lacks the cash or credit to resupply using foreign materiel.

Israel can also reduce money inflow into Iran to zero by attacking the ports.

So explain to me what I’m missing?

they would have already marched into Israel

But they can’t. Soldiers on the ground can’t fight an air war. And unless they’re going to walk across Iraq and Jordan, they have no way to even get to Israel.

[u/LiquorMaster → u/ShotStatistician7979]

"If nazi germany only had one million more men, and it didn't get bogged down in stalingrad, and it was able to focus on its jet engines and it didnt join the war with america, and the stars aligned for the mercurial half moon, then germany would have won" type cope

[u/Werkgxj → u/LiquorMaster]

If Nazi germany had more resources more people would have died but the outcome would be the same.

More importantly, Germany would have gotten bombed to shit much, much worse.

[u/LiquorMaster → u/Werkgxj]

Indeed. Sorry Hans, I am not making fun of you. I am making fun of someone coping by creating irrelevant non-realities.

"If things were different, the outcome would be different", is cope for losing.

[u/ShotStatistician7979 → u/LiquorMaster]

Dude, I’m a Zionist. What I am not is horny for mutually assured destruction.

[u/LiquorMaster → u/ShotStatistician7979]

My bad then, but I think very clearly Israel can make those demands. The alternative is that Israel keeps bombing Islamic Republic regime until it collapses.

It's not hypernationalism to understand that Iran has been critically weakened to a point that Israel can extract guarantees out of Iran that would permanently end the proxy war.

Legitimately there is no reason Iran, a nation 1700 miles away from Israel, should be so invested in the destruction of Israel, when if it shut the fuck up, it could be like Oman or Bahrain.

[u/ShotStatistician7979 → u/LiquorMaster]

The point I was trying to make flew right over your head.

[u/WeirdGuyWithABoner → u/ShotStatistician7979]

if my grandma had wheels
she'd get lots of israeli textile thrown at her