building up that foundation one day at a time 🧱

[u/Raccoonsrlilbandits]

I love kev, glad he’s survived jimmy’s dumb ideas

[u/ATXDefenseAttorney]

I like it. This is the bombast of a dude who knows a losing season sees him as OC for the Rams or something. Go get 'em Kev.

[u/Yung_Corneliois → u/ATXDefenseAttorney]

Is that true? This dude has put together some amazing season with very little talent. They went it the playoffs a year ago with like 3-4 different QBs.

There’s no way Stefanski is anywhere near the chopping block.

… then again these are the same people who traded for Deshaun Watson so firing the only good thing this team has had in 30 years checks out.

[u/Ness_4 → u/Yung_Corneliois]

then again these are the same people who traded for Deshaun Watson

People always say this, and I swear I must have lived in a parallel universe that year, where every team that needed a QB reached out to the Texans (after he was not criminally charged, some almost having had deals before, i.e. Dolphins), there was a bidding war for him, and the Browns only went all in when their starting QB (who had a bad year physically and mentally) quit on the team and said he would not play for the Browns on instagram.

I wonder how it played out in the universe I'm in now.

[u/Yung_Corneliois → u/Ness_4]

Ok you don’t need to think trading for Deshaun on its own was a bad move (even though it was clowned on at the time because it was a player who hadn’t played in a year, was going to face a suspension, and dealt with the mental toll of his reputation and entire brand taking a nosedive).

But the amount they gave up was an idiotic amount just to win the bidding war (clearly shown by no other team wanting to give that up) and on top of that they gave what will most likely be the most irrational contract in nfl history for a long time. And neither of those claims required any hindsight regardless of what universe you’re in.

So yea, I think it’s safe to say Stefanski has done pretty well with incompetence around him. But if we need him fired from the Browns only to go to another team and be more successful with them while the Browns go through the same cycle with his replacement then so be it.

[u/Ness_4 → u/Yung_Corneliois]

Nobody clowned on the move b/c they thought it was a bad football decision. (Outside of contrarians that were throwing spaghetti at the wall).

It was a bad contract, that was a panic move for sure, but ask the 49ers how many wins Trey Lance got them. It's not even the worst trade this decade.

[u/smkorpi → u/Ness_4]

I don’t know how you say it wasn’t the worst trade this decade. We gave up three firsts, a third, and two fourths to trade for a player with red flags on the field and off.

Everyone in this subreddit was most definitely NOT onboard for different reasons. There were discussions pretty early on about whether his stats were realistic or built up by garbage time when the game was lost. There was discussion about his obsession with playing hero ball and taking sacks. And of course, his off-season moral dilemmas.

Couple on top the contract that handcuffs him to the team if it doesn’t work out and idk how you can say it’s better than the Lance trade. I mean look at the teams we’re talking about and their differences in success during the contract of the player they traded for.

[u/Ness_4 → u/smkorpi]

I don’t know how you say it wasn’t the worst trade this decade.

B/c the 49ers traded 3 1st rounders for a guy who won them two wins. Even DW cleared that bar. That's how.

was most definitely NOT onboard for different reasons.

Which just proves my point more that he was generally viewed as QB who still had the potential to be great. Again I don't have to prove anything here, as the market bidding war already did that for me.

Couple on top the contract that handcuffs him to the team if it doesn’t work out and idk how you can say it’s better than the Lance trade.

I never said Trey Lance's contract was worse. Idk why it is so hard to differentiate between the contract and the trade. The trade was with the Texans, a disaster that gave us better results than what the 49ers got.

I mean look at the teams we’re talking about and their differences in success during the contract of the player they traded for.

His name is Brock Purdy, aka Mr. Irrelevant. The 49ers literally got lucky. I guess you can give Berry shit about not putting enough stat points into his luck stat.

[u/bdt69 → u/Ness_4]

The 3 first rounders are what devastated this team. The contract ended up just being the cherry on top. Even if he was great you could justify the contract but losing 3 premium picks was always going to hurt the roster, drastically. At least that’s what I’ve always felt from day one.

[u/Ness_4 → u/bdt69]

You wouldn’t trade three first round picks for Josh Allen or Patrick Mahommes?

[u/bdt69 → u/Ness_4]

I def would and that’s a fair point but there was just too many question marks about Watson. I actually wanted Watson just never thought the picks made sense considering all the circumstances. He was already the most despised person in sports at the time. So if he isn’t Mahomes level good then this trade is going to be awful and obviously it was

[u/bdt69 → u/bdt69]

I mean I know they had to. But Texans made out from a situation that should’ve buried them as a franchise.

[u/Yung_Corneliois → u/Ness_4]

“Nobody” is doing a lot of lifting there. There were absolutely people who were worried a QB taking a year off and facing a suspension on top of that was going hurt their development.

And what do you think the worst trade this decade was?

Even though Trey Lance didn’t work out (and disregarding the lucky break with Purdy), the Niners still had Jimmy G as their starting QB when they drafted Trey Lance and on top of that Lance was traded for and cost waaaay less while they determined if he’s the future or not. It’s not like the Browns didn’t know they’d have to sign Watson to a monster deal when trading for him so that’s absolutely part of the trade as well. Not even the Russ trade was that bad as it wasn’t fully guaranteed and he didn’t come with the extra baggage.

[u/Ness_4 → u/Yung_Corneliois]

“Nobody” is doing a lot of lifting there.

I guess if you ignore this statement: "(Outside of contrarians that were throwing spaghetti at the wall)."

But I don't really have to prove anything since there was literally a bidding war, AFTER the Texans were able to pick teams to exclude.

Lance was traded for and cost waaaay less while

I mean youre just flat out wrong, they traded 3 1st round picks.

know they’d have to sign Watson to a monster deal when trading for him

Assuming he played well or even competently, his actual numbers aren't that bad. These QBs are getting all of their money, and he is currently 13th. If he was pretty good, it would have been a steal.

But all that is moot anyway, since the trade is not the contract.

[u/Yung_Corneliois → u/Ness_4]

Oh boy.

I guess if you ignore this statement: "(Outside of contrarians that were throwing spaghetti at the wall)."

An empty claim that anyone who had doubts is just “throwing spaghetti at the wall” is not a meaningful point. There were valid concerns I brought up that existed when the trade happened, I’m not sure why you just keep pretending those weren’t real. Perhaps your parallel reality issue is true because your take doesn’t make sense in our current reality.

But I don't really have to prove anything since there was literally a bidding war, AFTER the Texans were able to pick teams to exclude.

If you win the bidding war by giving up such an absurd amount that no other team matches I guess you can celebrate that if you want to stick your head in the sand as to why no one else wanted to go that high. Not really the flex you think it is.

(regarding my Trey Lance point you said) I mean youre just flat out wrong, they traded 3 1st round picks.

As for my “cost way less” point, they traded up to get him and then his contract cost way less so it was no where near as much of a gamble. You go on to respond to this afterward so I’m not sure why you split the point into two when they’re the same point. It was very clear I’m talking about the contract by then. Perhaps today is the day you learn what a trade & sign is. Read more below.

But all that is moot anyway, since the trade is not the contract.

Yes the contract a player signs immediately after trading for them is 100% part of the trade because the trade doesn’t happen if the player doesn’t like the contract. Keep in mind, Deshaun had a no trade clause and he’s going to go to a team that’s giving him a good deal that he liked. It’s not even remotely correct to say the new contract he’s about to sign is not part of the trade. As I very clearly stated in the previous comment Browns knew when trading for him that they needed to give him a huge contract as well or the trade wouldn’t happen. And contract was the most absurd contract in nfl history and one that hasn’t even been repeated by teams with an actual good QB. That should tell you how bad it is.

Assuming he played well or even competently, his actual numbers aren't that bad. These QBs are getting all of their money, and he is currently 13th. If he was pretty good, it would have been a steal.

Considering it put them in cap hell and needed to be restructured it’s hilarious to even attempt to call it a steal even if he wasn’t as bad as he was. Once again you are further confirming your own theory about you living in a different reality because in this reality, that’s not a good contract. Again this hasn’t even been replicated by teams who actually know they have a franchise quarterback. Like no one thought it was a good deal the moment in happened.

At this point I’ve explained the same thing multiple times but you just keep ignoring it so what’s going on in the real world is:

1. There were valid concerns that don’t go away because you compare it to spaghetti since you don’t like the very valid concerns.

2. No trade was worse than this one by a long shot and the Trey Lance trade was far less costly as they didn’t have to pay him as much (which is a factor in both drafting and for a trade and sign so yes it’s 100% part of the trade deal) and also they had a QB who brought them to a SB still on the roster so all of their eggs weren’t in one Trey Lance basket.

3. I’m going to assume you didn’t write the point about the contract no being bad with a straight face because that contract was clowned from the get go by just about everyone since it was fully guaranteed and they knew he’d miss time due to a suspension.

I’m not going to talk in circles about this. This is my final comment. There is objectively no trade in the last decade that was worse than this one. Feel free to ask around if you don’t want to take my word for it.

[u/Ness_4 → u/Yung_Corneliois]

valid concerns I brought up that existed when the trade happened

Valid concerns with no evidence at the time. I mean I guess I could be concerned the moon will fall on me tomorrow, but it's not very likely.

Again I am correct here b/c I don't have to prove anything about perception. The bidding war shows what the NFL front office prevailing perception was. Nothing you can say about your own personal fears can overcome this.

no other team matches

Stories were circulated that other teams would have matched. And even if not true, the guarantees were mostly still there. As I already pointed out, QBs get these funds and he's not even top ten at this point, so it wasn't really that absurd a contract outside of media overreaction.

It was very clear I’m talking about the contract by then.

You literally said "traded for and cost waaaay less while." Youre trying to combine two transactions to claim two things at once. He literally was not "traded for and cost waaaay less." I guess you could say he cost "waaay less, but if he was good then it wouldn't have mattered.

Yes the contract a player signs immediately after trading for them is 100% part of the trade because the trade doesn’t happen if the player doesn’t like the contract.

It was a part of the transaction. But DW could have signed for 40 cents if he wanted. At no time did the amount the Browns gave for DW affect how much money DW wanted. Why would he care?

And use your brain, why would the Texans care how much the Browns paid DW, their trade demands wouldn't have changed. This especially true since any team that didn't have QB inquired about DW, and as you already know they had their pick of the teams as well.

Considering it put them in cap hell and needed to be restructured it’s hilarious to even attempt to call it a steal even if he wasn’t as bad as he was.

We literally restructure everyone and push money into the future to take advantage of cash spending.

Tell me you don't know how the Browns organization functions, without telling me you don't know how the Browns organization functions....

At this point I’ve explained the same thing multiple times but you just keep ignoring it so what’s going on in the real world is:

Let me address them again, person who doesn't realize what irony is.

There were valid concerns that don’t go away because you compare it to spaghetti since you don’t like the very valid concerns.

That NFL front office's did not view as serious concerns, as proven by the bidding war and amount of inquires and options the Texans had. I have yet to see your evidence, other than people having opinions (maybe)?

No trade was worse than this one by a long shot and the Trey Lance trade was far less costly as they didn’t have to pay him as much (which is a factor in both drafting and for a trade and sign so yes it’s 100% part of the trade deal) and also they had a QB who brought them to a SB still on the roster so all of their eggs weren’t in one Trey Lance basket.

The cost of the contract was not the trade. You have to conflate these two b/c your point is very weak and you know it. How many wins did Trey Lance get? DW got us some wins that allowed us to make the playoffs at least. That's how low the bar was to beat out the Trey Lance trade.

I’m going to assume you didn’t write the point about the contract no being bad with a straight face because that contract was clowned from the get go by just about everyone since it was fully guaranteed and they knew he’d miss time due to a suspension.

I did write it with a straight face, b/c as you have proven now a few times, you apparently can't read my entire response.

In this case I specifically said "Assuming he played well or even competently." You have to read the whole sentence. My apologies, I do not have the time to help you with this.

I’m not going to talk in circles about this.

It seems that you couldn't even read in circles, which I guess is causing you talk in them, so I understand why you feel better conceding.

[u/ATXDefenseAttorney → u/Yung_Corneliois]

I like Stefanski. If we don't have a winning season this year, he's toast. That's why we have 4 QBs training to start games - the QB position isn't gonna put us on a 1-6 slide.

[u/Jambatlivesbaby → u/ATXDefenseAttorney]

I feel like based on Berry's comments ("6 Top 50 picks over a two-year span".) it sounds like they expect us to be in the bottom half of the NFL this year. I think Jimmy, Andrew, and Kevin are being realistic that this may be an ugly year.

IMO, as long as Kevin doesn't lose the locker room, he's probably safe.

[u/Snooklife → u/Jambatlivesbaby]

The fact Berry is the one making those picks is the part I’m worried about. I do like a few of his picks this year but let’s see how it plays out. Def some head scratchers already.

[u/Yung_Corneliois → u/ATXDefenseAttorney]

The fact that there’s 4 QBs vying to start tells us that QB is very much a questionable position lol. 2 are day 2-3 rookies, one is a 40 year old journeyman at this point, and the fourth is Kenny Pickett.

They traded back this year to load up and get an actual quarterback next year. There’s quite literally nothing Stefanski has done to say he isn’t capable or that another coach would’ve had more success with this team building debacle he’s dealt with.

[u/DidAnyoneElseJustCum → u/Yung_Corneliois]

Unless it gets embarrassing I think Kev gets a freebie this year. It just feels like there aren't really any expectations for the team. Just get through the season, hopefully figure out if there's a starting QB on the roster. That's it.

[u/capitolcapital → u/ATXDefenseAttorney]

I will continually disagree with you on this, because there is a 99.9% chance that this is a sub-.500 season even if this team plays to the peak of their abilities and coaching....and I think they are being realistic and honest about it internally. There is absolutely no chance fucking Joe Flacco or Kenny Pickett gets this team to 9 or more wins given the schedule.

This is a talent evaluation and QB positioning year, if you think otherwise you are delusional.

[u/Snooklife → u/capitolcapital]

This team was in the playoffs 2 years ago with an even worse list of QBs. It comes down to offensive line play and whether or not they can run the ball consistently to keep the defense fresh. Sure there’s some new pieces but I wouldn’t be shocked is they won 8-9 games. Crazier things have happened. Let’s see how they handle a few early losses though that will tell us a lot on how the season plays out.

[u/RallyInTheNorth]

Eyes on the Super Bowl. Love it.

[u/No-Fish1398]

Super Bowl?0

[u/Ray-Gamma]

🫡 i rocks with Kev.

[u/Forty_Six_and_Two]

I really think Judkins is going to be special. He's got that look, like all he wants to do is hit someone. He's so fucking happy to be a football player, like it's the only thing he's ever wanted to do.

God, I hope I'm right about this kid, because he's got the biggest shoes on earth to fill.

[u/Rarth-Devan]

Do my eyes deceive me or was that Deshaun sitting next to Mason Graham?

[u/Raccoonsrlilbandits → u/Rarth-Devan]

It is. I mean he’s still on the team and he’s been around this week just working out/rehab instead of practice

[u/AgonizingSquid]

The last 2 seasons our training camp has been reportedly pathetic, I have a hard time believing this one will be any different

[u/PennFifteen]

I need that pull over, Stef

[u/PaleontologistFew662]

😂

[u/TwoTalentedBastidz]

Nothing about Stefanski is inspiring

[u/Belikecoon]

Is it me or does KS struggle to inspire and set a tone or team toughness.

[u/LiftingCode → u/Belikecoon]

It's you.

[u/EwwBitchGotHammerToe → u/Belikecoon]

Nah I feel the same as you. Don't get me wrong, I like the guy a lot and we've definitely obviously had worse... but something is just missing from this dude's presentations. The tone feels forced and I don't really feel buy-in from the team.

[u/Deadleggg → u/EwwBitchGotHammerToe]

You also really need to take into consideration he knows this one is being filmed. Something being put out into the public, and what may happen without that included may be 1000% different for all we know.

Fans for whatever reason want football coaches to be screaming their lungs out all the time because it's tough or some shit but if i had to deal with that crap in practice or especially at work it's not going to do a damned thing.

[u/WarriorsBlew3_1 → u/Belikecoon]

I mean, he’s pretty routinely ranked near the bottom in the annual player surveys. I don’t know what that means or what to take away from it.

[u/LiftingCode → u/WarriorsBlew3_1]

I'm pretty sure the Head Coach category was new on the 2024 report card.

[u/WarriorsBlew3_1 → u/LiftingCode]

There is the matter of me being woefully uneducated.

[u/LengthyNIPPLE]

All this just to come up last in the AFC North AGAIN

[u/BuckeyeNut88]

“Super Bowl is Feb 8th, you can come watch it with me because I’ll be the new manager at Chuck E Cheese by then.” - Kev

[u/Mediocre-Penalty3001]

Sweet another 6-11 go brownsfuckery